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Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 2:20 pm
by so sorry
TheBaxter wrote:GRR Martin's original outline and description (with possible spoilers!) for the entire 3-book ASOIAF series

the main spoiler is the 5 characters GRRM foresaw surviving the entire series and being the focus of the tale. they're all still alive, and with one possible exception, all seem to still be as central to the story as they were in his original vision.

more fun, however, are reading all the things that have since changed. for example:

- sansa and joffrey have a baby!
- no red wedding! robb dies in battle, and catelyn flees north with bran and arya.
- a love affair between jon and... arya? it's looking like jon+dany might happen in the actual series, or, if it's a stark sister, jon+sansa. sansa seems the most different from her original character, since this describes her as staying loyal to joffrey. and arya is never all on her own after the first book, like she ends up in the actual series, so the description of arya here actually resembles sansa more than how arya turned out. that's also why i think arya, as one of the main 5 characters, may actually now be arya + sansa, or even just sansa. so even though arya is originall described as surviving til the end, i think she may actually not make it anymore.
- jon's true parentage revealed in the last book! little did GRRM know that his ultimate twist would be spoiled by a TV show of the same name before he ever finished that last book of his.
- dany kills drogo! (on purpose, i mean)
- jaime ruthlessly kills everyone and ascends to the iron throne! looks like cersei has taken over that part of his character (no mention of cersei in the letter).


Wild stuff! Not sure about that love affair business though...

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Tue Jul 05, 2016 7:54 pm
by Ribbons

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2016 12:41 am
by Peven
that is one dirty old fucked up dude. I guarantee he at least thought about putting human-dragon bestiality in there, too. why everyone thinks he is some adorable charming old guy has always been beyond me. I mean, sure, I love the show, but come on, when you consider all the rape and various sexual debauchery, some with decidedly underage girls, and it was written by some old guy with a santa beard.........he's not charmingly adorable, he's the old nasty dude who shows up at the strip club at 12:01 p.m. right after they open and just sits there making his $20 in $1's last until closing time.

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2016 9:29 am
by so sorry
Peven wrote:...but come on, when you consider all the rape and various sexual debauchery, some with decidedly underage girls, and it was written by some old guy with a santa beard.........he's not charmingly adorable, he's the old nasty dude who shows up at the strip club at 12:01 p.m. right after they open and just sits there making his $20 in $1's last until closing time.


Sitting right next to Steven King, he who had akid gang bang in his novel IT.

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2016 9:38 am
by TheBaxter
Peven wrote:that is one dirty old fucked up dude. I guarantee he at least thought about putting human-dragon bestiality in there, too. why everyone thinks he is some adorable charming old guy has always been beyond me. I mean, sure, I love the show, but come on, when you consider all the rape and various sexual debauchery, some with decidedly underage girls, and it was written by some old guy with a santa beard.........he's not charmingly adorable, he's the old nasty dude who shows up at the strip club at 12:01 p.m. right after they open and just sits there making his $20 in $1's last until closing time.


i don't think anyone thinks of GRRM as an adorable old man. he's a sadist and a perv (at least towards his characters; IRL, you'd have to ask his wife i guess). but if he was a choirboy, the ASOIAF series would be boring as fuck.
also, for as much rape and torture and sexual debauchery as there is in these books, i suspect it's still less than there was in the actual middle ages. or a modern-day college campus.

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2016 6:38 pm
by Ribbons
To me this just shows how much a story can change on the way from idea to finished work, that even an old pro like Martin ends up with something completely different from what he first imagined.

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2016 1:24 pm
by TheBaxter

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2016 2:44 pm
by so sorry



For the love of the Seven please be true!

And I will be faced/forced to buy the hardbound edition since there's no way in hell I'll be able to wait until the paperback comes out. Which will then mean I need to go back and buy the first 5 in hardbound because there's no way in hell I can have just one like that...

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Tue Nov 01, 2016 11:59 pm
by Ribbons
Bah! I'll believe it when George R.R. Martin confirms it.

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2016 2:47 pm
by Al Shut
I'll believe it when I hold the book in my hand

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Wed Nov 02, 2016 9:35 pm
by TheBaxter
i'll believe it when GRRM is still alive to finish and release A Dream of Spring 10 years from now.

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 2:41 pm
by TheBaxter
Ribbons wrote:Bah! I'll believe it when George R.R. Martin confirms it.


GRRM says The Winds of Winter is coming out this year.....







.... or not

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 3:31 pm
by so sorry
TheBaxter wrote:
Ribbons wrote:Bah! I'll believe it when George R.R. Martin confirms it.


GRRM says The Winds of Winter is coming out this year.....







.... or not



The man who cried book


That's funny


I think it will be out this year. (But hey, I thought the same thing last year),” he responded.


That's not

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 6:44 pm
by Fievel
At this point I'd be fine with him withholding the release until after the HBO series ends. I'm not saying to stop writing! But if he were to finish writing the books, edited, and ready for publication and released annually once the show finished? I'd be fine with that. Now I'm a fan brought in by the show, so I have a fraction of the time invested that some do. The show will end next year (2018), if I recall correctly. I think there would be a touch more demand from more casual fans if they wait. Hell...create an advertisement blitz on tv/Internet. There's bound to be significant changes between book and series. Milk that shit!

Don't mind me. Just thinking aloud.

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 7:15 pm
by TheBaxter
Fievel wrote:At this point I'd be fine with him withholding the release until after the HBO series ends. I'm not saying to stop writing! But if he were to finish writing the books, edited, and ready for publication and released annually once the show finished? I'd be fine with that. Now I'm a fan brought in by the show, so I have a fraction of the time invested that some do. The show will end next year (2018), if I recall correctly. I think there would be a touch more demand from more casual fans if they wait. Hell...create an advertisement blitz on tv/Internet. There's bound to be significant changes between book and series. Milk that shit!

Don't mind me. Just thinking aloud.


me too. i've read all the books up to this point, but now with just 2 seasons left, and with the stories having diverged so far already, i'd rather just finish off the tv show, and then go back and start the books fresh from the beginning. that's what i'm planning to do anyway, though with this season coming out in the summer, and then the last season next summer, it's entirely possible the show will end before there's another book to read anyway.

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 11:55 am
by Ribbons
The next book's gotta be ready before the final season at least, right? I mean... right?

Re: A Song of Ice and Fire

PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 3:45 pm
by Wolfpack
You expect too much.