Today's a Good Day If You're A John Wayne Fan, Pilgrim!

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Today's a Good Day If You're A John Wayne Fan, Pilgrim!

Postby Nordling on Tue May 22, 2007 1:30 pm

It looks like there's many DVDs released in celebration of John Wayne's 100th birthday this week. But three standouts:

RIO BRAVO 2-Disc Edition

THE COWBOYS Special Edition

TRUE GRIT Special Edition

TRUE GRIT is pretty good (and won John Wayne his only Oscar) but it's the first two that are damn near essential. RIO BRAVO is one of my favorite films, and THE COWBOYS is a great coming-of-age story.

Recommended, all.
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Postby The Todd on Tue May 22, 2007 1:36 pm

And to shoot down The Todd's tried-and-true Zoner Quizmania technique, Maureen O'Hara stars in NONE of these movies alongside The Duke.....
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Postby John-Locke on Tue May 22, 2007 1:38 pm

I hate John Wayne movies.
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Postby Nordling on Tue May 22, 2007 1:42 pm

You really shouldn't.
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Postby Theta on Tue May 22, 2007 1:43 pm

John-Locke wrote:I hate John Wayne movies.


You hate "Rio Bravo?" "The Searchers?" "Stagecoach?"

I'll grant you the Duke was in a LOT of stinkers, but the law of averages kicks in; he was in some great movies, too.
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Postby godzillasushi on Tue May 22, 2007 1:44 pm

Ohhhh I loved The Cowboys. I watched it when I was younger and it was very sad. Just imagining a kid in that position doing what they did. Crazily good stuff. True Grit was awesome too....though for other reasons. We always got a huge laugh out of how hardcore John Wayne was.
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Postby The Todd on Tue May 22, 2007 1:54 pm

John-Locke wrote:I hate John Wayne movies.


You should watch The Quiet Man (with Maureen O'Hara!). It'll change your mind.
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Postby Nordling on Tue May 22, 2007 4:03 pm

As I said on another board, I didn't become a fan until I got older. The Wayne films that work are so well-crafted and made, and he worked with some great directors. Plus, it's interesting to watch how Wayne tweaks his persona. He was very much aware of how he was perceived on screen, and he uses that to do some really interesting character work, and goes places with it that are fun and surprising to watch.
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Postby Keepcoolbutcare on Tue May 22, 2007 5:01 pm

Nordling wrote:Plus, it's interesting to watch how Wayne tweaks his persona. He was very much aware of how he was perceived on screen, and he uses that to do some really interesting character work, and goes places with it that are fun and surprising to watch.


when he wasn't doing propaganda films for the Republicans...THE GREEN BERETS, anyone?

Chuck D wrote:Elvis, was a hero to most but he never meant shit to me / straight up racist that sucker was simple and plain / Motherfuck him and John Wayne


yeah, yeah, STAGECOACH, RIO BRAVO, FORT APACHE (eerily prophetic to 'Nam), RED RIVER (his best film, btw), all brilliant, and there's no doubt that Wayne was the most iconic screen presence of generations past...

but motherfuck that right wing, propaganda (seriously, the GREEN BERETS is akin to Nazi recruitment films) pushing egotistical blowhard.

kinda appropriate that he, and unfortunately many others who worked on the film, got cancer from filming in a spot downwind from nuclear testing...
Personally, I'm an atheist in the voting booth and a theist in the movie theatre. I separate the morality of religion with the spirituality and solace of it. There is something boring about atheism.
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Postby minstrel on Tue May 22, 2007 5:06 pm

I thought it was "The Conqueror" that was filmed where there was nuclear radiation and that was the film that gave the Duke and others cancer.
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Postby Keepcoolbutcare on Tue May 22, 2007 5:08 pm

minstrel wrote:I thought it was "The Conqueror" that was filmed where there was nuclear radiation and that was the film that gave the Duke and others cancer.


yeah, I get so angry thinking about Le Duke that I forgot to mention that, and implied it was another film...
Personally, I'm an atheist in the voting booth and a theist in the movie theatre. I separate the morality of religion with the spirituality and solace of it. There is something boring about atheism.
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Postby godzillasushi on Tue May 22, 2007 5:10 pm

Keepcoolbutcare wrote:kinda appropriate that he, and unfortunately many others who worked on the film, got cancer from filming in a spot downwind from nuclear testing...


Do you have a link for that? Im not saying you're wrong, you just sparked my curiosity. I always thought he got cancer from smoking for his entire life....
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Postby The Vicar on Tue May 22, 2007 5:11 pm

minstrel wrote:I thought it was "The Conqueror" that was filmed where there was nuclear radiation and that was the film that gave the Duke and others cancer.


You are correct, sir.
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Postby The Vicar on Tue May 22, 2007 5:13 pm

The Todd wrote:
John-Locke wrote:I hate John Wayne movies.


You should watch The Quiet Man (with Maureen O'Hara!). It'll change your mind.


Truly.
I'm no John Wayne apologist.
He wasn't an actor, he was John Fucking Wayne.
There was a lot of that sort of thing going around Tinseltown at that time.
But occaisionally, Wayne & a role built for him ( The Quiet Man comes to mind ) would get together: then the shit works.

Watch The Conquerer if you want to laugh at le Duke until you vomit.
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Postby Doc Holliday on Tue May 22, 2007 5:59 pm

Where's that "Seperate the art from the artist" thread when you need it?

I loved John Wayne when I was dead young, like 6 or 7. Then you get older and you hear the various stories and it gets pretty hard to defend the guy, in terms of who he was off-camera. But in terms of his films, there are some absolute classics.

If he'd only made RED RIVER alone, amongst all the dross, I'd still forgive him his output - but throw RIO BRAVO, THE SHOOTIST, THE QUIET MAN and THE SEARCHERS in and anyone who questions his worth on celluloid needs to go back to film school.
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Postby Fried Gold on Tue May 22, 2007 6:03 pm

I saw Flying Leathernecks the other day. And it was really crap.
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Postby Cpt Kirks 2pay on Tue May 22, 2007 6:04 pm

Anyone not ice the subtle ways in which Han Solo models himself on the Duke? It IS there if you look for it. That says a lot.

No one can doubt the Duke's influence on icon personas.

Oh and The Searchers forever. Again, who remembers that scene where he stops dead at the end of a scene in a hut somewhere to give that indian girl that so powerful a 'if looks could kill' stare. All his hate and despisement is seen right there.

Massive. Now THAT is storytelling direction and acting on film.

Now why don't you all BUGGER off!!!?
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Postby Doc Holliday on Tue May 22, 2007 6:06 pm

Fried Gold wrote:I saw Flying Leathernecks the other day. And it was really crap.


No doubt - have you seen RED RIVER? THE SEARCHERS?
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Postby Cpt Kirks 2pay on Tue May 22, 2007 6:10 pm

Searchers is the one man! Monumentous. Check out that film he did with Ron Howard too.
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Postby Fried Gold on Tue May 22, 2007 6:19 pm

Doc Holliday wrote:
Fried Gold wrote:I saw Flying Leathernecks the other day. And it was really crap.


No doubt - have you seen RED RIVER? THE SEARCHERS?

Are they any better?

I only see John Wayne films when they're shown on either "Movie4Men" or that Sky channel which shows Bonanza 24/7 and one film per day.
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Postby Doc Holliday on Tue May 22, 2007 6:38 pm

Fried Gold wrote:
Doc Holliday wrote:
Fried Gold wrote:I saw Flying Leathernecks the other day. And it was really crap.


No doubt - have you seen RED RIVER? THE SEARCHERS?

Are they any better?


They really, really are. Not just his best, but right up there with any other Western you can think of.

But I do confess, there aren't any giant frickin robots in it.
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Postby Doc Holliday on Tue May 22, 2007 6:39 pm

Cpt Kirks 2pay wrote:Searchers is the one man! Monumentous.


Word!

Cpt Kirks 2pay wrote:Check out that film he did with Ron Howard too.


THE SHOOTIST. Last film he ever made - and in the film his character is dying from cancer - particularly poignant.
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Postby Cpt Kirks 2pay on Tue May 22, 2007 6:44 pm

From what little I saw of The SHootits - it was quite sad.
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Postby Cpt Kirks 2pay on Tue May 22, 2007 6:45 pm

Doc. You and me gotta educate this FG on John Waybne man.
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Postby minstrel on Tue May 22, 2007 8:01 pm

The Man Who Shot Liberty Valence.

Wayne was in it, but it was really more of a Jimmy Stewart film. Still, it's a classic.
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Postby Fried Gold on Tue May 22, 2007 8:38 pm

Doc Holliday wrote:
Fried Gold wrote:
Doc Holliday wrote:
Fried Gold wrote:I saw Flying Leathernecks the other day. And it was really crap.


No doubt - have you seen RED RIVER? THE SEARCHERS?

Are they any better?


They really, really are. Not just his best, but right up there with any other Western you can think of.

But I do confess, there aren't any giant frickin robots in it.

One wouldn't expect there to be.

Next time they're on the Movies4Men channel, I'll give them a go.
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Postby Brocktune on Tue May 22, 2007 8:50 pm

Keepcoolbutcare wrote:
Chuck D wrote:Elvis, was a hero to most but he never meant shit to me / straight up racist that sucker was simple and plain / Motherfuck him and John Wayne


one of my fave verses in any song ever!

Keepcoolbutcare wrote:
minstrel wrote:I thought it was "The Conqueror" that was filmed where there was nuclear radiation and that was the film that gave the Duke and others cancer.


yeah, I get so angry thinking about Le Duke that I forgot to mention that, and implied it was another film...


anytime i watch any of the berkeley musicals, or anything with dick powell, i cant help but laugh, and shake my head thinking that this seemingly good natured crooner is single handedly responsible for packing the Duke's colon with a hundred pounds of cancerous tumors.
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Postby PF Moon Deux on Tue May 22, 2007 8:51 pm

Oh. A chance to ramble...

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A fearsome screen presence and true star, the characters John Wayne etched under the gaze of Ford and Hawks were/are all superbly rendered; complex, fabled ghosts of the West that tower over Monument Valley.

In RED RIVER and THE SEARCHERS he explored the darker aspect of whatever persona he'd created, the latter (Ethan Edwards) a tormented soul who's dead eyes could tear a hole through your heart at a glance; "Le Duke" doesn't muck around here. It's a masterclass, completely untouchable. Then you have the archetypal Wayne roles: SHE WORE A YELLOW RIBBON, countless B-MOVIES, RIO BRAVO, etc. Strong, nuanced performances that gave spectators a 'HERO' whom they could respect and relate to.

Now, whatever a person may feel about the (many) duds and extreme RIGHT-WING dogma he stood for, to perpetuate the theory that he only ever played the same character would be a huge affront to the legacy of a true legend (one of the few) and great actor.
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Postby Nordling on Tue May 22, 2007 10:32 pm

Yeah, I don't much care about his life. I care about his movies, though. Judge the art, not the artist.
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Postby Theta on Tue May 22, 2007 11:54 pm

minstrel wrote:I thought it was "The Conqueror" that was filmed where there was nuclear radiation and that was the film that gave the Duke and others cancer.


They want you to believe that, but really, it was the shame of making "The Conqueror" that ultimately killed him. I mean, have you SEEN that piece of shit? Who thought freakin' John Wayne should be in a sword-and-sandals movie!

Oh, of interest to anybody on a DVD budget; it seems Warners has reissued "Stagecoach", "The Searchers", et. al. in budget-priced one-discers; $10 MSRP.
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Postby Vegeta on Wed May 23, 2007 12:02 am

I am blessed to live not 25 miles from his birthplace. It's like sacred...
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Postby Cpt Kirks 2pay on Wed May 23, 2007 12:21 am

minstrel wrote:The Man Who Shot Liberty Valence.

Wayne was in it, but it was really more of a Jimmy Stewart film. Still, it's a classic.


How could I have forgotten that?

An ULTIMATE John Wayne performance. The hard man persona is here through and through.

Not to mention a quintessential piece of acting by James Stewart, who demonstrates here why he was such a loveable actor. Man what a truly brilliant film and thorough film. One of the few movies that show just how painful and hard it is to be brave and heroic and in doing so also questions but defines what heroism really is. Talking about it now, I really wanna see the film again.

God, I swear I've seen Rio Bravo too. Damnit Duke! What's wrong with me?!
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Postby tapehead on Wed May 23, 2007 12:28 am

Fried Gold wrote:
Doc Holliday wrote:
Fried Gold wrote:
Doc Holliday wrote:
Fried Gold wrote:I saw Flying Leathernecks the other day. And it was really crap.


No doubt - have you seen RED RIVER? THE SEARCHERS?

Are they any better?


They really, really are. Not just his best, but right up there with any other Western you can think of.

But I do confess, there aren't any giant frickin robots in it.

One wouldn't expect there to be.

Next time they're on the Movies4Men channel, I'll give them a go.


Howard Hawks and John Ford respectively, two of the best directors (Ford maybe the greatest ever) to take a crack at the genre.
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