Star Trek TOS

The greatest TV in history is being made right now. The worst TV in history is being made right now.

Postby Maui on Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:10 pm

Fawst wrote:That's too bad, TNG has some really incredible storylines in there. Sure, some of the episodes get ridiculous (any time you see Worf wear a cowboy hat, any time Riker goes to the jazz bar on the holodeck, etc), but for the time, there was some really great stuff going on there...


Oh well, same applied to Battlestar Galactica. Just couldn't get used to anyone other than Richard Hatch and crew. :(

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Postby DennisMM on Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:16 pm

Yes, but original BSG was dreadful! It's good to transition to new BSG!
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Postby Maui on Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:22 pm

DennisMM wrote:Yes, but original BSG was dreadful! It's good to transition to new BSG!


Hatch was cute though.... :roll:

BTW, I didn't think it was so bad.
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Postby DennisMM on Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:31 pm

Fair enough. I was 16 and I watched it almost every week, hoping it would become good. It didn't, though they had a few interesting eps. "The Living Legend" was not bad at all and even better when one gives it credit for the current show's Commander Cain story. However, any credit the original show receives will be offset by the debit of

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Postby DinoDeLaurentiis on Wed Aug 01, 2007 9:39 am

As a far as a the animated series goes, it is a certainly available onna the DVD, anna iffa I remember a the Chicago meet-uppa correctly, the Chaka Khan, he picked it uppa for about a the $20, no?

Anna also iffa the Dino's memory, she serves him, the animated series, she was originally considered a the canon, as a the extension of a the original "5-year" mission from a the original series, eh? Inna'cluding many of a the principle writers from a the live-action show, no?

It was around a the time of a the Next Generation that a the Roddenberry, he went anna said "oh no, we dinna say it was a the CANON, heheheh..." excluding, of a course, the episode of a the Yesteryear, sacred to many of a the fans, no?
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Postby The Vicar on Thu Aug 02, 2007 7:39 am

Yeah, well, what can you expect from someone who married Majel Barrett instead of Nichelle Nichols .....
a mistake I would have never made.
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Postby Brocktune on Thu Aug 02, 2007 2:50 pm

The Vicar wrote:Yeah, well, what can you expect from someone who married Majel Barrett instead of Nichelle Nichols .....
a mistake I would have never made.


no shit.
Nichelle Nichols hasn't had to sell that pussy since she was 16. Majel Barrett is STILL selling it!
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Postby The Vicar on Thu Aug 02, 2007 3:04 pm

Brocktune wrote:
The Vicar wrote:Yeah, well, what can you expect from someone who married Majel Barrett instead of Nichelle Nichols .....
a mistake I would have never made.


no shit.
Nichelle Nichols hasn't had to sell that pussy since she was 16. Majel Barrett is STILL selling it!


Oh gawd....the visuals....
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Postby papalazeru on Thu Aug 02, 2007 3:15 pm

DennisMM wrote:Scary geek moment:

TOS had 79 episodes if you count "The Menagerie" two-parter as one. In high school I could write out the titles of at least 70, from memory.


Much more impressive than naming all 50 states.



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Postby Fried Gold on Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:10 pm

So I've finally managed to acquire some of the Remastered episodes. The new effects sequences are incredibly hard to spot, some are only noticeable when they're pointed out.

In fact, I could barely tell some of the episodes had been touched....which, I suppose, was the point of the exercise - not to change, just to update. I think I was expecting them to make some of the scenes a bit more dynamic.

It hasn't made the crummy stories any better either.
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Postby DennisMM on Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:22 pm

Just compare them to Supercar and you won't feel so bad.
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Postby papalazeru on Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:24 pm

I'm annoyed that this thread only has SO much love.

It deserves more considering a shuttle was sent into space with it's name and that the astonauts were in awe of meeting the Trek Crew.

First ever interatial kiss on TV, folks!!!

Edit: and Best theme tune in the world with it's wonderful cha-cha beat.
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Postby Fried Gold on Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:36 pm

DennisMM wrote:Just compare them to Supercar and you won't feel so bad.

Mike Mercury could take James Kirk any day.
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Postby papalazeru on Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:44 pm

Fried Gold wrote:
DennisMM wrote:Just compare them to Supercar and you won't feel so bad.

Mike Mercury could take James Kirk any day.


Maybe NOW! but Krk in the day...he was a stud.
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Postby Fried Gold on Fri Apr 11, 2008 8:01 pm

But Kirk is scared of puppets.
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Postby The Vicar on Fri Apr 11, 2008 10:23 pm

Fried Gold wrote:So I've finally managed to acquire some of the Remastered episodes. The new effects sequences are incredibly hard to spot, some are only noticeable when they're pointed out.

In fact, I could barely tell some of the episodes had been touched....which, I suppose, was the point of the exercise - not to change, just to update. I think I was expecting them to make some of the scenes a bit more dynamic.

It hasn't made the crummy stories any better either.


The Doomsday Machine was improved - the scenes of the wrecked Constellation didn't make me giggle. The improvements are more obvious on an ep like this, with a lot of exterior shots.
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Postby Fried Gold on Sat Apr 12, 2008 9:50 am

I've just got to Amok Time. The new shots of Vulcan are something of a mixed blessing. They do look fantastic BUT they don't really blend too well with the rest of the episode.
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Postby The Vicar on Sat Apr 12, 2008 5:43 pm

Its a pity they couldn't find a way to remove everything but the actors and green screen the shit out of STOS. It is a bit of a return to reality when you leave a nice CGI shot of meteors bouncing off the corpse of the USS Constellation, then cut to cardboard sets and primary colors.
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Postby DennisMM on Sat Apr 12, 2008 7:59 pm

The Vicar wrote:Yeah, well, what can you expect from someone who married Majel Barrett instead of Nichelle Nichols .....
a mistake I would have never made.


Yeah, he just fucked Nichelle Nichols when he thought Barrett wasn't looking - while Roddenberry was still married to wife #1 (not to be confused with Number One). Having a second-level mistress hiding from your first-level mistress is pretty weird.
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Postby Fried Gold on Sat Apr 12, 2008 8:08 pm

The Vicar wrote:Its a pity they couldn't find a way to remove everything but the actors and green screen the shit out of STOS. It is a bit of a return to reality when you leave a nice CGI shot of meteors bouncing off the corpse of the USS Constellation, then cut to cardboard sets and primary colors.

Yep, also in something like "The Galileo Seven" where one minute you are looking a beautifully rendered quaser system and the next you're seeing Ensign Ricky fighting a stuntman wearing a carpet.
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Postby The Vicar on Sat Apr 12, 2008 8:11 pm

DennisMM wrote:
The Vicar wrote:Yeah, well, what can you expect from someone who married Majel Barrett instead of Nichelle Nichols .....
a mistake I would have never made.


Yeah, he just fucked Nichelle Nichols when he thought Barrett wasn't looking - while Roddenberry was still married to wife #1 (not to be confused with Number One). Having a second-level mistress hiding from your first-level mistress is pretty weird.


Bastard knew how to multi-task. Gotta give him props there.
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Postby Fried Gold on Sat Apr 12, 2008 8:13 pm

Is Roddenberry the reason Yeoman Rand was fired?
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Postby DennisMM on Sat Apr 12, 2008 8:35 pm

She had a rough personal life, some her own fault and some not. Apparently by the mid-'60s she was a hardcore drinker and also used hard drugs sometimes. She was unreliable at times. She says she was assaulted by an executive connected to TOS but won't say who. Theories are that she was fired because

1. the Janice Rand character was not considered to have a future, since the producers decided a love interest on the ship wasn't a good idea (this was the official line for aes)

2. Whitney's drug use and other problems made her a liability to the production (the unofficial line for a long while)

3. the sexual assaults made her dangerous to have around (never the official line to my knowledge).

Whitney's life became very sad after TOS. She did some work as a singer and actress but fell further into drugs and booze and turned to prostitution for some time before she got clean in the '80s. One has to wonder if she ever put on that basket-weave hairstyle for a client.
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Postby Fried Gold on Sat Apr 12, 2008 8:45 pm

DennisMM wrote:She says she was assaulted by an executive connected to TOS but won't say who.

That's what I was referring to. I was wondering if Roddenberry was one of the possible suspects.
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Postby DennisMM on Sat Apr 12, 2008 9:47 pm

Ah. Sorry I misunderstood. Quite possible, though I think she would have named him in her book, especially since Nimoy supposedly offered her a great deal of support at the time. Even with his assistance she probably couldn't face the Great Bird of the Galaxy's witch widow and her lawyer minions.
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Postby Brit Pop on Sun Apr 13, 2008 7:44 am

Season 2 - Episode "Friday's Child"

This is the one where they beam down to a planet inhabited by (more Klingon than Klingon) Capellans to get mining rights... but the Klingons had the same idea and a power struggle insues.

My favorite bit in this episode is near the start, the away team are talking to the Capellans, when the Klingon appears - Kirk's red-shirted ensign panics... "A KLINGON!!", and goes for his phaser... a Capellan reaches for his boomerang/frisbie type thing and takes out the ensign.

The reason I find this bit so great is, when Kirk is crouched over the body of the ensign, he says (in regards to the ensign's eagerness to fight)..

"He was young"

THE DUDE WAS ABOUT 50 YEARS OLD!!!
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Postby The Vicar on Sun Apr 13, 2008 9:44 am

Maybe the Ensign had had some work done....plastic surgery had to improve by the 25th century.
Or maybe Kirk's was overdue for those glasses McCoy gave him in Wrath o Khan.
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Postby Brit Pop on Sun Apr 13, 2008 3:35 pm

Actually, the guy I was thinking of... this guy... aint that old after all.

Still, funny scene!

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Postby The Vicar on Tue May 06, 2008 1:02 pm

I hope he didn't die with that expression on his face.
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Postby Fried Gold on Tue May 06, 2008 1:18 pm

If you look closely, he's actually phasered himself in the knackers.
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Postby Peven on Tue May 06, 2008 4:13 pm

yeah, and he had his phaser set to "stimulate"
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Re: JJ's STAR TREK (Now w/ 100 % More Trailerage)

Postby papalazeru on Mon May 04, 2009 4:02 pm

thefraze wrote:Saw "Star Trek" at a screening over the weekend and was blown away! I've never been a Trekkie - always more of a Star Wars kid, but this film has sold me on the whole series.

In fact, I've got Season One of the original series on my Netflix right now!


Now you will see the true power of the show, not some over blown explosive mess. True trek power lies in ToS Trek. Everyone knows it.
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Re: JJ's STAR TREK (Now w/ 100 % More Trailerage)

Postby thefraze on Mon May 04, 2009 4:22 pm

I remember watching TNG and catching other versions of Star Trek on television and never caring for them - but something about the characters of TOS has always interested me - I'm only a few episodes in, but I'm already enjoying it.
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Re: JJ's STAR TREK (Now w/ 100 % More Trailerage)

Postby RogueScribner on Mon May 04, 2009 4:31 pm

It might be the fact that the TOS characters didn't walk around with a PC stick up their butts all the time. The Berman era of Trek is largely bland. Bah.
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Re: Star Trek TOS: Best and/or Worst

Postby Fried Gold on Mon May 04, 2009 4:59 pm

From the JJ film thread: {This was the only Trek TV thread the search came up with. Can this become the catch-all thread?}

papalazeru wrote:
thefraze wrote:Saw "Star Trek" at a screening over the weekend and was blown away! I've never been a Trekkie - always more of a Star Wars kid, but this film has sold me on the whole series.

In fact, I've got Season One of the original series on my Netflix right now!


Now you will see the true power of the show, not some over blown explosive mess. True trek power lies in ToS Trek. Everyone knows it.


thefraze wrote:I remember watching TNG and catching other versions of Star Trek on television and never caring for them - but something about the characters of TOS has always interested me - I'm only a few episodes in, but I'm already enjoying it.


RogueScribner wrote:It might be the fact that the TOS characters didn't walk around with a PC stick up their butts all the time. The Berman era of Trek is largely bland. Bah.


Peven wrote:come on folks, there is a thread for discussing the Star Trek tv shows, lets not clutter this thread up anymore with bitching and whining about the good 'ol days of bad acting and cheesy fx.....
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Re: Star Trek TOS

Postby Lord Voldemoo on Mon May 04, 2009 5:06 pm

good call, FG. I just merged all of the pertinent posts from that thread to this one (except Peven's, I deleted that one...sorry Pev).
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Re: Star Trek TOS

Postby Peven on Mon May 04, 2009 5:08 pm

:(
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Re: Star Trek TOS

Postby Pacino86845 on Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:09 pm

I have seen most episodes of Next Generation, grew up with the show really and consider myself to be a fan of the series even today.

Only watched the first couple of seasons of DS9 before losing interest, when apparently the show became arguably the best spin-off Star Trek series.

Have only seen the first five or so episodes of Babylon 5.

So now a question to fellow sci fi fans more versed in Babylon 5 and DS9 than I am.

I found a decent deal for the full series of DS9 on DVD, and from my understanding, much like Babylon 5, you need to watch the entire series to really appreciate DS9... so should I go for it or just buy Babylon 5 instead?
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Re: Star Trek TOS

Postby stereosforgeeks on Wed Oct 21, 2009 3:25 pm

Pacino86845 wrote:I have seen most episodes of Next Generation, grew up with the show really and consider myself to be a fan of the series even today.

Only watched the first couple of seasons of DS9 before losing interest, when apparently the show became arguably the best spin-off Star Trek series.

Have only seen the first five or so episodes of Babylon 5.

So now a question to fellow sci fi fans more versed in Babylon 5 and DS9 than I am.

I found a decent deal for the full series of DS9 on DVD, and from my understanding, much like Babylon 5, you need to watch the entire series to really appreciate DS9... so should I go for it or just buy Babylon 5 instead?


Babylon 5 is better because the characters are actually in danger and it's story is better as well.
DS9 utilized ideas from B5 but it's still a Trek show with all the limitations that entails.
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Re: Star Trek TOS

Postby Fried Gold on Wed Oct 21, 2009 7:03 pm

Pacino86845 wrote:I have seen most episodes of Next Generation, grew up with the show really and consider myself to be a fan of the series even today.

Only watched the first couple of seasons of DS9 before losing interest, when apparently the show became arguably the best spin-off Star Trek series.

Have only seen the first five or so episodes of Babylon 5.

So now a question to fellow sci fi fans more versed in Babylon 5 and DS9 than I am.

I found a decent deal for the full series of DS9 on DVD, and from my understanding, much like Babylon 5, you need to watch the entire series to really appreciate DS9... so should I go for it or just buy Babylon 5 instead?

With Babylon 5 you need to watch it from start to finish (the final fifth season is arguably not essential for various reasons). The quote "it was a novel made for television" is fairly apt, as missing an episode is pretty much like skipping a chapter of a book (I'm tempted to use The Wire as a more mainstream example...but I think that may draw some criticism). The first season can be quite difficult to get through and featured far more standalone episodes, to the point where there are lists of "key" episodes that allow to you pass over the crap without fearing consequence. Season 3 is considered by some to the definitive televisual science fiction story. I preferred Season 4. Some of the acting can be a bit too hokey, as can some of production as a whole. It was always being threatened by cancellation, so occasionally the pacing gets ramped up for no reason.

Some (JMS) reckon that Babylon 5 was shopped to Paramount in the late 80s and they turned it down...only to copy it and develop Deep Space Nine.

And at the start they are quite similar.

The first two seasons of DS9 don't particularly matter in the grand scheme of things. Some of it was based on strands from TNG while at the same time it was trying to be a bit different. It wasn't until the latter part of season 3 that things started to get going (I seem to think TNG had the same problem). Season 4 onwards really hit the spot. Imagine Star Trek with complex storylines and developed characters (difficult I know) and that's DS9 gives you. There is long-running continuity, multiple plot arcs and all kind of cool shit going on (see avatar for more information). A good rule of thumb with DS9 is that from the time Captain Sisko gets a goatee, there are few bad episodes.

I used to really like Babylon 5, but over time I've grown to find some of it really irritating (I have the boxsets, but would only really think of watching particular episodes now). Where as Deep Space Nine now holds my attention and I'm quite enthusiastic for it.

Personal recommendation - DS9.

If you're curious, and it's cheap - Babylon 5. If it hooks you, you'll be pleased.
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Re: Star Trek TOS

Postby Pacino86845 on Wed Oct 21, 2009 7:14 pm

Ooh, most excellent reply FG, just the sort of feedback I was looking for. Thanks to stereos as well, but it's not making the decision easier!!

I think I will go for DS9 ultimately because I have already seen portions of the first two seasons, and I've seen a couple of season 3 episodes here and there... I already have some investment to some of the characters (Sisko, Quark, Worf, etc.), so familiarity might make me go for DS9 ultimately. Also the deal I found is $180 for the whole of DS9, whereas Babylon 5 is selling pretty high from what I've seen so far.
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Re: Star Trek TOS

Postby papalazeru on Wed Oct 21, 2009 9:00 pm

Fried Gold wrote:
Pacino86845 wrote:I have seen most episodes of Next Generation, grew up with the show really and consider myself to be a fan of the series even today.

Only watched the first couple of seasons of DS9 before losing interest, when apparently the show became arguably the best spin-off Star Trek series.

Have only seen the first five or so episodes of Babylon 5.

So now a question to fellow sci fi fans more versed in Babylon 5 and DS9 than I am.

I found a decent deal for the full series of DS9 on DVD, and from my understanding, much like Babylon 5, you need to watch the entire series to really appreciate DS9... so should I go for it or just buy Babylon 5 instead?

With Babylon 5 you need to watch it from start to finish (the final fifth season is arguably not essential for various reasons). The quote "it was a novel made for television" is fairly apt, as missing an episode is pretty much like skipping a chapter of a book (I'm tempted to use The Wire as a more mainstream example...but I think that may draw some criticism). The first season can be quite difficult to get through and featured far more standalone episodes, to the point where there are lists of "key" episodes that allow to you pass over the crap without fearing consequence. Season 3 is considered by some to the definitive televisual science fiction story. I preferred Season 4. Some of the acting can be a bit too hokey, as can some of production as a whole. It was always being threatened by cancellation, so occasionally the pacing gets ramped up for no reason.

Some (JMS) reckon that Babylon 5 was shopped to Paramount in the late 80s and they turned it down...only to copy it and develop Deep Space Nine.

And at the start they are quite similar.

The first two seasons of DS9 don't particularly matter in the grand scheme of things. Some of it was based on strands from TNG while at the same time it was trying to be a bit different. It wasn't until the latter part of season 3 that things started to get going (I seem to think TNG had the same problem). Season 4 onwards really hit the spot. Imagine Star Trek with complex storylines and developed characters (difficult I know) and that's DS9 gives you. There is long-running continuity, multiple plot arcs and all kind of cool shit going on (see avatar for more information). A good rule of thumb with DS9 is that from the time Captain Sisko gets a goatee, there are few bad episodes.

I used to really like Babylon 5, but over time I've grown to find some of it really irritating (I have the boxsets, but would only really think of watching particular episodes now). Where as Deep Space Nine now holds my attention and I'm quite enthusiastic for it.

Personal recommendation - DS9.

If you're curious, and it's cheap - Babylon 5. If it hooks you, you'll be pleased.



Tim: Babylon 5's a big pile of shit.

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It's an awesome and completely underated series. Garibaldi has one of the best roles in TV. Oh and Bruce Boxleitner's role is fantastic. DS9 and Every other sci fi has something to learn from this series
Papa: The musical!

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Re: Star Trek TOS

Postby Pacino86845 on Wed Oct 21, 2009 9:04 pm

From what I gather DS9 DID learn from Babylon 5! :lol:
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Re: Star Trek TOS

Postby Fried Gold on Wed Oct 21, 2009 9:10 pm

papalazeru wrote:It's an awesome and completely underated series. Garibaldi has one of the best roles in TV. Oh and Bruce Boxleitner's role is fantastic. DS9 and Every other sci fi has something to learn from this series

I'm always in two minds about Bruce Boxleitner. Sometimes I think that there's some real power to his performances. Other times it's pretty cheesy.

And they made him say "NOW GET THE HELL OUT OF......" too many times.
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Re: Star Trek TOS

Postby papalazeru on Wed Oct 21, 2009 9:24 pm

Fried Gold wrote:
papalazeru wrote:It's an awesome and completely underated series. Garibaldi has one of the best roles in TV. Oh and Bruce Boxleitner's role is fantastic. DS9 and Every other sci fi has something to learn from this series

I'm always in two minds about Bruce Boxleitner. Sometimes I think that there's some real power to his performances. Other times it's pretty cheesy.

And they made him say "NOW GET THE HELL OUT OF......" too many times.


And Picard had the same problem with..."No...Let's talk to them and find out what's really their problem"

Or Kirk with "No...Let's fuck the closest female looking alien"
:)

They all had their faults...except TOS had the music to back it up.

*Trumets* BaBa Baaa Baaaa Baaa Baaa Baaa Bababa.....
*drums* Dum da dum da dum dum da
*Trumets* BaBa Baaa Baaaa Baaa Baaa Baaa Bababa
Papa: The musical!

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DennisMM: "...Decidedly unclassy..."
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Re: Star Trek TOS

Postby The Vicar on Wed Oct 21, 2009 9:27 pm

The best thing about Babylon 5 was G'Kar, played by the late Andreas Kastulas

Image

His character arc was epic, and the man did exceptional work under layers of latex and foam.
For that character alone, B5 is worth your time.
There were other very fine characters, in secondary roles ( Zathuras - an odd, funny alien character; Marcus Cole - a Ranger { thinking LoTR? } Lennir - played by Bill Lost in Space Mumy; the aforementioned Garibaldi ) and did anyone mention that Harlan Ellison was a creative consultant?
I could enjoy the series even though I don't much care for Bruce Boxleitner. Can't explain why, just don't. But the grand sweep of the thing is to be admired and the exceptional episodes are great payoffs for the patience of the viewer.
I loved the episodes, more than a year apart, called Babylon Squared and War Without End, which contained some damned nice work by all involved and featured the character Zathuras ( the late Tim Choate ). Excellant.
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Re: Star Trek TOS

Postby Fried Gold on Wed Oct 21, 2009 9:41 pm

The Vicar wrote:The best thing about Babylon 5 was G'Kar, played by the late Andreas Kastulas

Image

His character arc was epic, and the man did exceptional work under layers of latex and foam.
For that character alone, B5 is worth your time.
There were other very fine characters, in secondary roles ( Zathuras - an odd, funny alien character; Marcus Cole - a Ranger { thinking LoTR? } Lennir - played by Bill Lost in Space Mumy; the aforementioned Garibaldi ) and did anyone mention that Harlan Ellison was a creative consultant?
I could enjoy the series even though I don't much care for Bruce Boxleitner. Can't explain why, just don't. But the grand sweep of the thing is to be admired and the exceptional episodes are great payoffs for the patience of the viewer.
I loved the episodes, more than a year apart, called Babylon Squared and War Without End, which contained some damned nice work by all involved and featured the character Zathuras ( the late Tim Choate ). Excellant.

Yeah, it's certainly worth watching for G'kar and Londo.
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Re: Star Trek TOS

Postby stereosforgeeks on Wed Oct 21, 2009 10:53 pm

Honestly DS9 did a ton for star trek and growing it up as FG said. My main gripe with it is mainly that being a star trek show it still never had any true sense of danger and people being killed off etc... While there are repercussion to episodes the majority of things are sorted by the end of each episode unless its a multi-parter. There is some damn strong character work in the show and some awesome secondary characters that show up like wallace shawns zek. It's definitely a good show and well worth watching. I just didnt happen to like it's main storyline.

Unfortunately there is quite a bit to overcome while watching babylon 5. The production values some hokey acting etc... but I think it's a much more rewarding experience in the long run. The plot is far more complex and characters are pretty great even ones with bad actors. Straczynski has a lot of strengths as writer, creating great detailed worlds, layering tons of storylines, complex characters, etc... but his weaknesses are incredibly apparent when you start watching as well. I think he was going to be able to overcome his worst tendencies with Crusade but the show never really had a shot of making it.

I ould love to see Straczynski tackle another show but since Jeremiah (an underrated but flawed show as well). he doesnt seem too interested.
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Re: Star Trek TOS

Postby stereosforgeeks on Sun Oct 25, 2009 11:37 am

Just saw that the full Babylon 5 series is posted at Slash Control

You'd still need to get the movies though.
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Re: Star Trek TOS

Postby Pacino86845 on Sun Oct 25, 2009 12:32 pm

In the mean time I went ahead and ordered DS9... 176 44-minute episodes? Holy crap that's gonna take a while to get through! :shock:
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