LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

The greatest TV in history is being made right now. The worst TV in history is being made right now.

How did you feel about the finale?

Loved it
10
38%
Liked it
6
23%
Disappointed
5
19%
Konged
5
19%
 
Total votes : 26

Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby MacCready on Mon May 24, 2010 12:21 am

At the end there were enough red herrings left standing to feed the entire island of Japan sushi for a decade.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 1:11 am

best television show ever

anyone complaining about dangling threads or unanswered questions.... missed the point entirely.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby ironic name on Mon May 24, 2010 1:45 am

pretty good.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby ironic name on Mon May 24, 2010 1:54 am

even though it was a little silly, Vincent = Christian = God[?] was awesome.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby bill blake on Mon May 24, 2010 2:06 am

clair looked like sally strothers.

christian shepard - i would like to see how many people posted about that because it went completely over my head until tonight. i love it. as long as i'm being all pious and shit; i thought the stained glass in the
all-religi-church was great. what's the wheel in the lower left corner?

so did vincent help desmond out of the well?

i would still like to know how jack and hurley and kate got sent back to the past.

this show was good. i'm going to miss it.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby John-Locke on Mon May 24, 2010 2:11 am

I almost posted something a few days ago about how the perfect way to end the show would be a shot of Jacks eye closing, I wish I did because I would look mega intuitive right now, but I did think it though, I swears.

I've got loads of questions still but none of them really matter.

FRANK LAPIDUS FOR THE MOTHER FUCKING WIN!
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby ironic name on Mon May 24, 2010 2:26 am

John-Locke wrote:I almost posted something a few days ago about how the perfect way to end the show would be a shot of Jacks eye closing, I wish I did because I would look mega intuitive right now, but I did think it though, I swears.

I've got loads of questions still but none of them really matter.

FRANK LAPIDUS FOR THE MOTHER FUCKING WIN!

it was a fairly cool concept of closure, I believe you.
I once said on the fuselage way back in season two that at the end they'd get metaphysical and it'd end with them admitting to being actors in a show, while that wasn't explicit it was 4 or 5 realities [our real reality, the lost island reality, the sideways reality, the sideways reality boarding gate to heaven, the post lost reality with richard and miles and lapidus and sawyer becoming the A team] and the scene of the concert lights being put away with kate and jack, plus the feeling of the inside of the Christ the Redeemer Church they went into felt like a bow to the audience.
I was pretty stoked that in a way I knew the ending since season 2, but since its open to interpreting your mileage may vary, but I tell you, I knew frank lapidus was alive.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby ironic name on Mon May 24, 2010 2:29 am

I'm also glad they were still able to throw a fastball at us, re the sideways world, which was God's waiting room.
for the first time in a while, lost surprised me.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby bastard_robo on Mon May 24, 2010 2:39 am

So sideways world was..a not so bad purgatory..

Hurley is new King of Lost Island, with Ben his loyal subject.

Jack died with Vincent.. that was kinda nice.

Still irked about why:

Statue? No Pregnant Chicks? Dharma Drops?

Sigh.. DVD release, Here I come...
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby bastard_robo on Mon May 24, 2010 2:59 am

Actually, scratched that "It was what it was shit"

WHY WAS IT SO FUCKING IMPORTANT TO KEEP SMOKEY ON THE ISLAND? If all it took was to uncork the power source for a minute to fucking shank him, WHY DIDNT SOMEONE DO IT SOONER?

It's like the crow, grab the damn bird, and kill his powers.

I'm glad everyone got a big jolly happy ending in purgatory, but fuck me sideways, just give us a little bit of answers to the NOW so that we can care more when you finish off..
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby Fievel on Mon May 24, 2010 3:59 am

bastard_robo wrote: No Pregnant Chicks?


I'm assuming that it's the amount of electromagnetic activity on the island.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby so sorry on Mon May 24, 2010 8:40 am

So did Jack really pass the torch to Hurley before he went in the light cave? He didn't chant over the bottle of water (like NotMom did for Jacob and Jacob did for Jack).

Or was this a case of Jack making up his own rules?


Me=confused=infinity
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby The Ginger Man on Mon May 24, 2010 9:16 am

That was just stupid.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby Jakester on Mon May 24, 2010 9:40 am

I think whoever is "Jacob" gets to make the rules.

I expect that Richard wasn't there because he wasn't dead. I guess Eko and Michael were stuck on the island.

Everything in the sideways universe makes sense in the context of being in purgatory or limbo. I'm just not sure that the happy ending was really satisfying. I did like Ben's apology to Locke, though. That was moving. Now I'm left wondering about the other "people" in limbo, though. If Jack didn't have a son, was he just a construct? Did he only exist when he was with Juliet or Jack? What about the other "people," like, say Alex's friends at school? How about the principal? Were they real? I know it doesn't matter, but how's that shit work, man?
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 9:56 am

bill blake wrote:christian shepard - i would like to see how many people posted about that because it went completely over my head until tonight. i love it. as long as i'm being all pious and shit; i thought the stained glass in the
all-religi-church was great. what's the wheel in the lower left corner?


it was the Dharma Wheel

pretty clever...
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 10:00 am

John-Locke wrote:I almost posted something a few days ago about how the perfect way to end the show would be a shot of Jacks eye closing, I wish I did because I would look mega intuitive right now, but I did think it though, I swears.[/size]


in a way, it was such an obvious last shot that i'm surprised nobody thought of it (or at least thought of it AND posted it) ahead of time. at least, i never read or saw anyone guess at that final shot anywhere. and for once, i can actually believe they DID know what the final shot of the show would be from pretty early on.

vincent laying down next to jack, though, really sold it.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby John-Locke on Mon May 24, 2010 10:02 am

From Damon Lindelofs Twitter, 6 hours ago

Damon Lindelof wrote:Remember. Let go. Move on. I will miss it more than I can ever say.


For me the show was always about the journey not the destination, I might not love the afterlife ending as a narrative tool but I can appreciate why they used it just to give some kind of closure to the whole thing.

Was Lost perfect? not at all, however when it was good it was really fucking good and as a piece of entertainment that is all that really matters at the end of the day.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 10:04 am

bastard_robo wrote:Actually, scratched that "It was what it was shit"

WHY WAS IT SO FUCKING IMPORTANT TO KEEP SMOKEY ON THE ISLAND? If all it took was to uncork the power source for a minute to fucking shank him, WHY DIDNT SOMEONE DO IT SOONER?


desmond was the only one who could go down into the well/pool/waterfall/whatever-it-was because of his ability to survive the electromagnetic forces. anyone else who would've tried to go down there would've died. or at least would've been turned into a smoke monster.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby John-Locke on Mon May 24, 2010 10:07 am

TheBaxter wrote:vincent laying down next to jack, though, really sold it.


:P

I love how the simple use of a dog has so much emotional resonance, it's a tried and tested guarantee to pull at the ol' heart strings.

You wouldn't get that with a fucking cat now would you.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 10:08 am

so sorry wrote:So did Jack really pass the torch to Hurley before he went in the light cave? He didn't chant over the bottle of water (like NotMom did for Jacob and Jacob did for Jack).

Or was this a case of Jack making up his own rules?


Me=confused=infinity


yes. in the afterlife, hurley tells ben he was a good number two, and ben told hurley he was a good number one. so hurley really did take over from jack as island protector, and ben did serve as his 2nd-in-command. and they served as island protectors for many more years (or centuries, or whatever).

either that, or hurley was calling ben a little shit and ben misunderstood him.

btw, i loved that ben chose not to go "into the light" because he still had "stuff to work out". though i have a feeling the "stuff" he's gonna be working out will be in rousseau's bed.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 10:10 am

John-Locke wrote:
TheBaxter wrote:vincent laying down next to jack, though, really sold it.


:P

I love how the simple use of a dog has so much emotional resonance, it's a tried and tested guarantee to pull at the ol' heart strings.

You wouldn't get that with a fucking cat now would you.



not unless it's this cat

















i still refuse to actually watch that video. it would probably make me cry more than the lost finale.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 10:18 am

Jakester wrote:I think whoever is "Jacob" gets to make the rules.

I expect that Richard wasn't there because he wasn't dead. I guess Eko and Michael were stuck on the island.

Everything in the sideways universe makes sense in the context of being in purgatory or limbo. I'm just not sure that the happy ending was really satisfying. I did like Ben's apology to Locke, though. That was moving. Now I'm left wondering about the other "people" in limbo, though. If Jack didn't have a son, was he just a construct? Did he only exist when he was with Juliet or Jack? What about the other "people," like, say Alex's friends at school? How about the principal? Were they real? I know it doesn't matter, but how's that shit work, man?


that's probably one of the things we'll be theorizing about for eternity. my guess is, only the people who we saw in the "real world" actually truly exist in the purgatory world. ana lucia was real, because desmond said she's "not ready yet". ben was real, and remained behind by choice. i think rousseau and alex are real too, and maybe they'll have their own wake-up moments and then head into the light together (though i can't imagine rousseau will be too happy with ben when she remembers the island... i hope she forgives him like locke did, or else he's in for a very long afterlife). faraday and charlotte are real too, and will sooner or later have their own wake-up moments, unless eloise hawking-widmore has anything to say about it. same for detective myles, widmore, professor arzt, etc etc.

as for the rest: jack's son - not real, never existed. keamy - i don't know, what happens when you die in the afterlife? do you go to the after-afterlife?

and what about aaron? no matter how long he lived in the real world, apparently he's stuck being a newborn infant in the afterlife. that's gotta suck.

i think my 'field of dreams' comparison earlier in this thread was more apt than i even realized. but even i didn't know that, like the movie, the final scene would involve an emotional reunion between a long-dead father and his estranged son.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 10:31 am

John-Locke wrote:From Damon Lindelofs Twitter, 6 hours ago

Damon Lindelof wrote:Remember. Let go. Move on. I will miss it more than I can ever say.


For me the show was always about the journey not the destination, I might not love the afterlife ending as a narrative tool but I can appreciate why they used it just to give some kind of closure to the whole thing.

Was Lost perfect? not at all, however when it was good it was really fucking good and as a piece of entertainment that is all that really matters at the end of the day.


i think the most successful thing about the finale is that it did remind me of the journey, and reinforced the point that the journey was what was important; that, and the people who are part of the journey with you. all the mythology stuff, as much as i enjoyed it, wasn't the point of the show. the show was just one small chapter in the much longer history of the island, beginning sometime well before NotMom and her two NotSons, and extending past Hurley-Ben's tenure as island guardians, probably on and on. do we need to see more about the island from before or after those times? i don't. do we need to see anything from when Hurley took over on the island? just those two lines between hurley and ben in the afterlife was all i need to know about that chapter of the island's history.

knowing what big stephen king fans they are, and knowing about king's own writings on the subject, how the journey is more important than the destination, i felt like that's what they went for in the finale, and they made it work.

in a way, the finale reminded me a lot of six feet under. particularly because (SFU spoilers) everyone died at the end, although without a doubt the six feet under finale was more poetic in its final moments. but the lost finale hit me harder, probably for a lot of reasons: i like the show better overall, was more attached to this show, and also i watched SFU all the way through in about a year or so, so i didn't live with the show and those characters like i have with lost, which i've watched as it aired from the very beginning. like i wrote earlier, i do think it will be a much different experience for people who watch the show on DVD and didn't watch it during its run, and it will probably be less satisfying for those people.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby MacCready on Mon May 24, 2010 10:35 am

TheBaxter wrote:best television show ever

anyone complaining about dangling threads or unanswered questions.... missed the point entirely.


Nice dismissive line to excuse sloppy writing. Anyone stupid enough to wonder about all the dangling threads "missed the point entirely". Really.
Since we're all so stupid, perhaps you can explain why the people who won't slavishly accept gaping plot holes, dead ends and straw men are dumber than the people who do? And that point was?
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby John-Locke on Mon May 24, 2010 10:37 am

What they should have done is after the Final LOST graphic they should have shown Hurley & Ben on the Island at some point in the future, have them looking out to Sea to see another Plane or a boat or what have you nearing the island, something like that, then play the Lost Mystery Music (like at the end of Season 1 with the Hatch). I hope they at least filmed something like that and that it's on the DVD.

One thing I am disappointed about is no Hurley Bird, I was expecting it to make another appearance at some point.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby so sorry on Mon May 24, 2010 11:04 am

I can buy the notion (from the writers and fans) that the journey outweighs the destination. But for me, I guess all the open ended questions and dead ends really hampered the journey. I dig the destination, I dig the notion of their lives (after lives) being forever linked. But I can't get past things like Eloise Hawking knowing what's going on, anything to do with Walt, finding out that Jack's kid really didn't exist, what happened to Kate/Sawyer/Miles et all, etc.

Still my favorite show in many, many years, and I look forward to being enlightened (pun!) over the next couple of weeks as to what people thought the ending was about. But really really wish some more of my questions were answered.


And as a card carrying Jack-knob-slobberer from Day 1, it was heartbreaking to watch him and Kate finally get together, only to have him die. Yes, they meet up in the afterlife and whatnot, but poor Kate had to live out the rest of her days without Jack, which must have been tortorous for her.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby ironic name on Mon May 24, 2010 11:09 am

richard, sawyer, miles and lapidus need to have a spinoff where they fly around solving crimes.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby sonnyboo on Mon May 24, 2010 11:29 am

I'm curious if anyone else is with Jimmy Kimmel and think that Jack and everyone died on the plane and that started everything as an afterlife storyline.

It seems to me the show started off dancing the line of being possibly afterlife stuff on the island or science fiction. Then they firmly put themselves in science fiction with time travel, the hatch, and electromagnetism. Now it feels like they decided to add spiritualism to the mix too and make it ALL OF THE ABOVE in the end.

Maybe Kimmel is right. Maybe Jacob and the MIB were angels/demons that brought spirits to the island to debate the core of humanity as they did not know they were dead.

Because if everything on the island was real, but everything in the side-story is spiritual and purgatory, then it convoluted the entire universe they created solely because the writers had backed themselves into a corner where they killed so many people without resolutions, this was the only way they could think of to get out of it.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 11:33 am

MacCready wrote:
TheBaxter wrote:best television show ever

anyone complaining about dangling threads or unanswered questions.... missed the point entirely.


Nice dismissive line to excuse sloppy writing. Anyone stupid enough to wonder about all the dangling threads "missed the point entirely". Really.
Since we're all so stupid, perhaps you can explain why the people who won't slavishly accept gaping plot holes, dead ends and straw men are dumber than the people who do? And that point was?


i suppose "the point" is different for different people. but they have been saying for a LONG time now that not every question would be answered. the big questions were answered - maybe not in a way that satisfied everyone (which would have been impossible), maybe not as definitively as some would have liked (and maybe TOO definitively for others... again, pleasing everyone would have been impossible). getting into the minutiae, the occasional plot hole, dead end, or red herring, is only a path to misery. the point, for me, was to resolve the big questions and the big themes of the show in a way that paid off the characters in an emotionally satisfying way, that highlighted the journey that these characters went on to get to their final destination, and that we the audience were along for the ride on.

if the point of the show for you was to answer every single mystery and question the show raised -- well, the writers and producers long ago said that wasn't the point of the show for them. the meaning is in the characters and their journeys, and the ultimate goal of the island mythology and the mysteries along the way was to highlight the process of these characters healing themselves, letting go, and making peace for themselves. you can be disappointed that they didn't make the show you wanted to make, but i choose to enjoy the show the DID make and enjoy it for what it was and what it was meant to be.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 11:37 am

John-Locke wrote:What they should have done is after the Final LOST graphic they should have shown Hurley & Ben on the Island at some point in the future, have them looking out to Sea to see another Plane or a boat or what have you nearing the island, something like that, then play the Lost Mystery Music (like at the end of Season 1 with the Hatch). I hope they at least filmed something like that and that it's on the DVD.

One thing I am disappointed about is no Hurley Bird, I was expecting it to make another appearance at some point.


well, the only reason all those boats and planes and such were brought to the island was for jacob to find a replacement, and as pawns in his war against smokey. with smokey dead and jacob gone, there's no real need for hurley to bring people to the island. i suppose he would have to find a replacement eventually, but he wouldn't necessarily need to follow jacob's kinda messed-up way of going about it. like ben said, that was jacob's way, but maybe he can find a better way.

i think when hurley asked jack what he was supposed to do as island guardian, and jack said something like "do what you always do, take care of people" or something along those lines... well, maybe they could've ended with ben going "da plane, da plane" as some seaplane came in for a landing, and hurley would be there in a white suit, waiting to make each of their fantasies come true. it would be "lost: the fantasy island years"
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby MacCready on Mon May 24, 2010 11:40 am

so sorry wrote:I can buy the notion (from the writers and fans) that the journey outweighs the destination. But for me, I guess all the open ended questions and dead ends really hampered the journey. I dig the destination, I dig the notion of their lives (after lives) being forever linked. But I can't get past things like Eloise Hawking knowing what's going on, anything to do with Walt, finding out that Jack's kid really didn't exist, what happened to Kate/Sawyer/Miles et all, etc.

Still my favorite show in many, many years, and I look forward to being enlightened (pun!) over the next couple of weeks as to what people thought the ending was about. But really really wish some more of my questions were answered.


And as a card carrying Jack-knob-slobberer from Day 1, it was heartbreaking to watch him and Kate finally get together, only to have him die. Yes, they meet up in the afterlife and whatnot, but poor Kate had to live out the rest of her days without Jack, which must have been tortorous for her.


Did you know you missed the point entirely? Yeah, me too. If you really loved the show, you're supposed to shrug and say Damon Lindelof moves in mysterious ways.
Sorry. Can't. Read and seen too much good writing and plotting to let things like that simply slide by.
How often was the audience told how special and important Walt was. And in the end? As Walter Mondale once famously asked...."Where's the Walt?"
Oh that's right - they couldn't write their way around that problem, so they simply didn't. Walt who? Was he in this?
Yeah, I liked the show. I liked Hurley a lot. There were some nice characters, interesting dynamics, and moments ( Jin & Sun's death) that were emotional effective. But I have too much respect for good writers, for real pros, to simply accept the sorts of insults to the intellect that the Lost writers perpetrated. This was not the greatest show ever. No. Was it a good show? Sure. Could it have been better? Absolutely. But for now it is what it is. And what it is is a show that threw everything it could at the wall, and the bits that didn't stick they simply ignored. Can't tie up a plot point? Don't bother!
And I seem to recall someone in here complaining about the pseudo religious ending to BSG, but where did this show end? With everyone sitting in a church that suddenly floods with the bright white light of Jeebus, after a guy called Christian Shepard ( oh what a giveaway) opens the doors.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 11:52 am

sonnyboo wrote:I'm curious if anyone else is with Jimmy Kimmel and think that Jack and everyone died on the plane and that started everything as an afterlife storyline.

It seems to me the show started off dancing the line of being possibly afterlife stuff on the island or science fiction. Then they firmly put themselves in science fiction with time travel, the hatch, and electromagnetism. Now it feels like they decided to add spiritualism to the mix too and make it ALL OF THE ABOVE in the end.

Maybe Kimmel is right. Maybe Jacob and the MIB were angels/demons that brought spirits to the island to debate the core of humanity as they did not know they were dead.

Because if everything on the island was real, but everything in the side-story is spiritual and purgatory, then it convoluted the entire universe they created solely because the writers had backed themselves into a corner where they killed so many people without resolutions, this was the only way they could think of to get out of it.


i don't buy that kimmel theory. i did like the earlier one he asked matthew fox about, when he said the whole show could be interpreted as jack's "test", and that the island stuff was testing jack to make him better, overcome his faults and demons, and succeed in what he needed to do, and he ultimately passed the test, with his awakening in the sideways world and moving on being his reward.

i have a bit of a theory that, in the beginning, the writers actually did intend for the island itself to be purgatory. but then, when everyone started theorizing about the show and some people guessed early on that the island was purgatory, that went "Uh oh! they've already guessed the ending, we're gonna have to change it" and so they went a different way, but then came back to the purgatory thing in the final season, and used the sideways storyling to tell the purgatory story they originally intended to tell with the island storyline. either way, i thought it was kind of clever that they spent a whole season working in the purgatory storyline, and snuck it in there without us knowing, and while still sticking to their contention that "the island is not purgatory" that they definitively stated early on.

btw, speaking of kimmel:

i loved seeing the reunion of ozone and turbo. that was awesome... but also a bit creepy. ozone especially. i mean, turbo just kinda got studly, but ozone, that dude looks more corpse-like than christian shephard and coffin-locke combined.

also, they stole my idea about parodying the end of newhart. and newhart is also looking a bit coffin-ready these days.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby so sorry on Mon May 24, 2010 11:56 am

I'm literally going back and forth between anger and resentment and being content over what I witnessed last night.

My expectations were high, and I knew damn well that I wasn't going to get all the answers that I wanted.

It funny to look back to season 1 and 2 (and 3) and realize that all that Dharma stuff, all the mystery surrounding them and what it all meant, only to find out that they were a blip on the radar screen of the history of the island. They were pretty damn close to useless when you look back, no? Sure, their digging into the island's innards begat the hatch which begat the machine which begat the all-important 815 crash, but they were mearly a means to get our LOSTies on the island, and really nothing more? Hmmm, urge to kill...rising.

P.S. Interspersed between the hate/rage/unabashed apologists in the LOST talkback are some good observations, so if you have the stomach (and time) I suggest you go in there. Just remember to wear your hipwaders, the shit is pretty deep!
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby John-Locke on Mon May 24, 2010 12:10 pm

so sorry wrote:realize that all that Dharma stuff, all the mystery surrounding them and what it all meant, only to find out that they were a blip on the radar screen of the history of the island. They were pretty damn close to useless when you look back, no? Sure, their digging into the island's innards begat the hatch which begat the machine which begat the all-important 815 crash, but they were mearly a means to get our LOSTies on the island, and really nothing more? Hmmm, urge to kill...rising.


See I like that they were really only on the island so that what happened with our Losties happened, it makes me like the show more, not less.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 12:10 pm

MacCready wrote:
so sorry wrote:I can buy the notion (from the writers and fans) that the journey outweighs the destination. But for me, I guess all the open ended questions and dead ends really hampered the journey. I dig the destination, I dig the notion of their lives (after lives) being forever linked. But I can't get past things like Eloise Hawking knowing what's going on, anything to do with Walt, finding out that Jack's kid really didn't exist, what happened to Kate/Sawyer/Miles et all, etc.

Still my favorite show in many, many years, and I look forward to being enlightened (pun!) over the next couple of weeks as to what people thought the ending was about. But really really wish some more of my questions were answered.


And as a card carrying Jack-knob-slobberer from Day 1, it was heartbreaking to watch him and Kate finally get together, only to have him die. Yes, they meet up in the afterlife and whatnot, but poor Kate had to live out the rest of her days without Jack, which must have been tortorous for her.


Did you know you missed the point entirely? Yeah, me too. If you really loved the show, you're supposed to shrug and say Damon Lindelof moves in mysterious ways.
Sorry. Can't. Read and seen too much good writing and plotting to let things like that simply slide by.
How often was the audience told how special and important Walt was. And in the end? As Walter Mondale once famously asked...."Where's the Walt?"
Oh that's right - they couldn't write their way around that problem, so they simply didn't. Walt who? Was he in this?
Yeah, I liked the show. I liked Hurley a lot. There were some nice characters, interesting dynamics, and moments ( Jin & Sun's death) that were emotional effective. But I have too much respect for good writers, for real pros, to simply accept the sorts of insults to the intellect that the Lost writers perpetrated. This was not the greatest show ever. No. Was it a good show? Sure. Could it have been better? Absolutely. But for now it is what it is. And what it is is a show that threw everything it could at the wall, and the bits that didn't stick they simply ignored. Can't tie up a plot point? Don't bother!
And I seem to recall someone in here complaining about the pseudo religious ending to BSG, but where did this show end? With everyone sitting in a church that suddenly floods with the bright white light of Jeebus, after a guy called Christian Shepard ( oh what a giveaway) opens the doors.


i don't care whether the ending was pseudo-religious or spiritual or whatever. i don't have to believe in ghosts or heaven to enjoy 'field of dreams', i don't have to believe in demons and exorcisms to enjoy 'the exorcist' and i don't have to believe in flaming eyes and wizards and hobbits to enjoy 'lord of the rings.' every show or movie or book or story has it's own reality, and i can accept that fictional reality for the duration of the story as long as it is well-told, even if it doesn't agree with my own view of reality.

the big problem with BSG is it didn't answer ANY of the big questions the series raised. it just threw up its hands at the end and said "god did it all". lost didn't answer everything, but it answered the big stuff. and those answers were completely consistent with how the show played out from beginning to end. i was disappointed walt wasn't there at the end (since they were all in the afterlife, they could have totally justified having 8-foot-tall walt in the room without it violating any kind of plot consistency or anything) but wondering what was special about walt... was that really THAT important on the show? a character who hasn't even been on the show, except for a couple cameos, since season 2? and people really expected that to be something that was addressed in the finale? i mean, if you went into the last show expecting answers to questions like that, i think you were just setting yourself up for disappointment.

i can play the quibble game all day long with this show, just like any other: i mean, if you really want to complain about walt, here's one for you. we know that dead people appear to the living on the island in 2 ways: either as ghosts of people killed on the island and trapped there (like michael), or as manifestations of smokey (who as far as we know can only take the form of dead people). so, when big walt appeared to john locke after ben shot him in season 3(?), how did that happen? it couldn't have been smokey, and it wasn't a ghost since he didn't die (at least, not on the island). my guess would be, since walt had psychic abilities, that he may have psychically projected to the island to give locke that message, probably at jacob's behest (like how jacob told widmore to bring desmond back to the island). that's doing a lot of my own filling in, but you know what? it's just not a big deal to me. i'm happy to fill in the little holes here and there.

maybe because i've never gone back and rewatched the previous seasons, i've just watched it from beginning to end, i haven't gotten overly invested in old questions. it will be interesting to rewatch the series now, knowing how it will end, to see just how significant all that walt stuff really was, and some of the other dead ends. if i had rewatched season 1 over and over as the series played out, i would probably put more weight on stuff like that. i think the blessing and curse of this show for its creators, the obsessive attention of the fans to details and plot points and mysteries, it kept interest up on the show for a long time, but also forced them to answer things they probably never wanted or couldn't answer. maybe they should have expected that earlier. but i think, considering what they were trying to pull off, they succeeded way beyond what could reasonably be expected. the most important thing is that they answered the big questions, and in a way that was satisfying and consistent. given that, i'm not gonna sweat the small stuff.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 12:16 pm

John-Locke wrote:
so sorry wrote:realize that all that Dharma stuff, all the mystery surrounding them and what it all meant, only to find out that they were a blip on the radar screen of the history of the island. They were pretty damn close to useless when you look back, no? Sure, their digging into the island's innards begat the hatch which begat the machine which begat the all-important 815 crash, but they were mearly a means to get our LOSTies on the island, and really nothing more? Hmmm, urge to kill...rising.


See I like that they were really only on the island so that what happened with our Losties happened, it makes me like the show more, not less.


i go back and forth on the dharma stuff. i really liked the mystery of it all during season 2. but i think whatever disappointment i had in dharma's role, i dealt with back in season 5 when it became apparent how limited their role was. and part of me does like that the island story is ultimately epic enough that something like dharma (which, really, could have been a series to itself, all about this mysterious island where the ultimate answer was that the island was a base for some super-secret society doing experiments on time travel, psychic phenomena and the nature of reality) could ultimately be just a small blip on a much bigger canvas.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby so sorry on Mon May 24, 2010 12:23 pm

John-Locke wrote:
so sorry wrote:realize that all that Dharma stuff, all the mystery surrounding them and what it all meant, only to find out that they were a blip on the radar screen of the history of the island. They were pretty damn close to useless when you look back, no? Sure, their digging into the island's innards begat the hatch which begat the machine which begat the all-important 815 crash, but they were mearly a means to get our LOSTies on the island, and really nothing more? Hmmm, urge to kill...rising.


See I like that they were really only on the island so that what happened with our Losties happened, it makes me like the show more, not less.



Yeah that's fine for the plot of the show. But for us, the viewers, Dharma was set up to be so much more than that. They had fake websites, fake videos, fake contests for the first few years dealing with Dharma. And in the end all that theorizing and discussion was irrelevant right? None of us could have guessed at this outcome, so all our countless posts discussing this stuff was pointless!
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby so sorry on Mon May 24, 2010 12:25 pm

And before I forget:

So Sayid spends his life pining over this Iraqi chick, whom he has literally killed for (and died for?), only to find out in the afterlife that his soulmate is some vacuous white chick that he knew for a few weeks?

NADIA GOT SCREWED!
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby John-Locke on Mon May 24, 2010 12:29 pm

MacCready wrote:where did this show end? With everyone sitting in a church that suddenly floods with the bright white light of Jeebus, after a guy called Christian Shepard ( oh what a giveaway) opens the doors.


Like most people here I'm not religious and as it happens I'm only slightly spiritual, I can appreciate something for what it is as long as it plays by the rules of the World it sets itself out in. If the Light @ the heart of the Island is the same as the light inside us all then it is perfectly within the confines of the show for the Lost Souls to return to the same light when they accept that they are dead and are ready to move on, maybe into another life or what have you. The Church thing was because Jack was going to have his Dads funeral there and because doing it the opposite way would have alienated those who do have religious beliefs, those without organised beliefs couldn't care less, we are used to people having their silly indoctrinated ideas. Even if you are one of the few people who don't have an ounce of spirituality in your body I think you'd be hard pressed to find someone who wouldn't like to believe in the possibility of there maybe being something more to existence & the very concept of consciousness than atoms & molecules and energy etc. Just the fact that there is matter and that anything exists (let alone self aware life) is amazing in it's own way and for me the show tapped into that in it's own ambiguous way.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby so sorry on Mon May 24, 2010 12:30 pm

TheBaxter wrote:... given that, i'm not gonna sweat the small stuff.


But there in lies my problem today: "the small stuff" wasn't really small stuff. Walt's story line was what season 2 was all about. Literally from his abduction to Michael's betrayal etc. All around the plot point of Walt being special. And then he disappears and that's that? How do you not feel stiffed over this? Not small stuff at all in my opinion.

And yeah, all along I've been saying that I will go back and watch all 6 seasons again at some point in my life. But I don't think I will be able to do that now. I think I would be literally making a list of things that ultimately didn't make sense given the outcome of the show, which would totally ruin my love for LOST.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby MacCready on Mon May 24, 2010 12:55 pm

so sorry wrote:
TheBaxter wrote:... given that, i'm not gonna sweat the small stuff.


But there in lies my problem today: "the small stuff" wasn't really small stuff. Walt's story line was what season 2 was all about. Literally from his abduction to Michael's betrayal etc. All around the plot point of Walt being special. And then he disappears and that's that? How do you not feel stiffed over this? Not small stuff at all in my opinion.

And yeah, all along I've been saying that I will go back and watch all 6 seasons again at some point in my life. But I don't think I will be able to do that now. I think I would be literally making a list of things that ultimately didn't make sense given the outcome of the show, which would totally ruin my love for LOST.


Don't bother. You'll be told "yeah, but its the journey....", which seems to be the mantra of those wishing to pretend that the writers did give them a reach around.
If so many steps in the "journey" were bogus, based on plot lines and events that never pay off in terms of relevance or context, then the "journey" itself is compromised.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby sonnyboo on Mon May 24, 2010 12:56 pm

so sorry wrote:And before I forget:

So Sayid spends his life pining over this Iraqi chick, whom he has literally killed for (and died for?), only to find out in the afterlife that his soulmate is some vacuous white chick that he knew for a few weeks?

NADIA GOT SCREWED!


OH YEAH. I saw that. Apparently stunt casting means more in heaven, so that mean Mike Ovitz is god in the LOST mythology.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 1:42 pm

so sorry wrote:
John-Locke wrote:
so sorry wrote:realize that all that Dharma stuff, all the mystery surrounding them and what it all meant, only to find out that they were a blip on the radar screen of the history of the island. They were pretty damn close to useless when you look back, no? Sure, their digging into the island's innards begat the hatch which begat the machine which begat the all-important 815 crash, but they were mearly a means to get our LOSTies on the island, and really nothing more? Hmmm, urge to kill...rising.


See I like that they were really only on the island so that what happened with our Losties happened, it makes me like the show more, not less.



Yeah that's fine for the plot of the show. But for us, the viewers, Dharma was set up to be so much more than that. They had fake websites, fake videos, fake contests for the first few years dealing with Dharma. And in the end all that theorizing and discussion was irrelevant right? None of us could have guessed at this outcome, so all our countless posts discussing this stuff was pointless!


i suppose if you feel the purpose of the show was to guess the outcome ahead of time, it would seem pointless. i don't see it that way. all the theorizing and stuff was fun, but i never really expected to get it right. plus, it's not like people didn't get some things right. there were some correct guesses along the way, among all the incorrect guesses and crazy theories. plus, how do you know we DIDN'T guess the outcome ahead of time. it's not like all the scripts were written in stone in the first season and never changed since then. i'm still liking my theory that the original plan was to have the island be purgatory, and they changed it after the fans figure it out too soon. if i'm right, then not only was it not pointless, it even made them change the ending of the show!

i do feel like an important theme of the finale was that the journey was as important, or moreso, then the destination. and so far as lost goes, part of the journey for us was all the theorizing and puzzling out of what things meant or where things were heading. and like i wrote in a previous post, i think that was as much a part of the fun of the show as the show itself, and "being wrong" doesn't make any of that theorizing less fun for me.

i think the purpose of this show, ultimately, was to be entertaining, not to be a puzzle that you were supposed to figure out and then find out in the last episode whether you were right or not. i mean, is it the purpose of 'the sixth sense' to figure out that bruce willis is a ghost before the last scene? is it the purpose of 'the usual suspects' to figure out keyser soze's identity before the film reveals it? or is it just to sit back and let the film entertain you and then give you that twist as a bonus.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 1:45 pm

so sorry wrote:And before I forget:

So Sayid spends his life pining over this Iraqi chick, whom he has literally killed for (and died for?), only to find out in the afterlife that his soulmate is some vacuous white chick that he knew for a few weeks?

NADIA GOT SCREWED!


yeah, i didn't really care for the sayid-shannon hookup. it was a bit forced, they certainly weren't on the level of a sawyer-juliet or desmond-penny. if anything, it should've been boone-shannon hooking up.

but i'll accept it under the premise that they are not actually "soulmates" but just that their island relationship was a key to them letting go of their pre-island life and going into the light.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 1:46 pm

John-Locke wrote:
MacCready wrote:where did this show end? With everyone sitting in a church that suddenly floods with the bright white light of Jeebus, after a guy called Christian Shepard ( oh what a giveaway) opens the doors.


Like most people here I'm not religious and as it happens I'm only slightly spiritual, I can appreciate something for what it is as long as it plays by the rules of the World it sets itself out in. If the Light @ the heart of the Island is the same as the light inside us all then it is perfectly within the confines of the show for the Lost Souls to return to the same light when they accept that they are dead and are ready to move on, maybe into another life or what have you. The Church thing was because Jack was going to have his Dads funeral there and because doing it the opposite way would have alienated those who do have religious beliefs, those without organised beliefs couldn't care less, we are used to people having their silly indoctrinated ideas. Even if you are one of the few people who don't have an ounce of spirituality in your body I think you'd be hard pressed to find someone who wouldn't like to believe in the possibility of there maybe being something more to existence & the very concept of consciousness than atoms & molecules and energy etc. Just the fact that there is matter and that anything exists (let alone self aware life) is amazing in it's own way and for me the show tapped into that in it's own ambiguous way.


yeah, exactly. and don't forget: pencils are miracles.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby Fievel on Mon May 24, 2010 1:48 pm

No Nikki & Paulo in the finale = FAIL.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby Fievel on Mon May 24, 2010 1:51 pm

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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby so sorry on Mon May 24, 2010 1:53 pm

Ben: so last week he "joins" NotLocke, and kills Widmore. We are led to believe that he is now Smokey's #2 (like Sayid was before him), killing whoever he says to kill. But we (the viewers) all figured he'd double cross Smokey in the end. Well, ben didn't get a chance to double cross NotLocke. So did he really go to the dark side, and come back again to ultimately help Jack and Hurley? Was his choice to join NotLocke a ruse that never got played out? (PS I really really thought it should have been Ben who shot NotLocke, not Kate).

Or did I miss something obvious (as per my usual :oops: )


Desmond: when did NotLocke realize that Desmond was his key to destroying the island? Because if he knew all along, then why the fuck did he throw him down a well and ask Sayid to kill him?


Or did I miss something obvious (as per my usual :oops: ) Part II
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 1:54 pm

so sorry wrote:
TheBaxter wrote:... given that, i'm not gonna sweat the small stuff.


But there in lies my problem today: "the small stuff" wasn't really small stuff. Walt's story line was what season 2 was all about. Literally from his abduction to Michael's betrayal etc. All around the plot point of Walt being special. And then he disappears and that's that? How do you not feel stiffed over this? Not small stuff at all in my opinion.

And yeah, all along I've been saying that I will go back and watch all 6 seasons again at some point in my life. But I don't think I will be able to do that now. I think I would be literally making a list of things that ultimately didn't make sense given the outcome of the show, which would totally ruin my love for LOST.


well, that's how i felt about BSG, but i suppose at some point i may still go back and rewatch it.

there's no doubt that walt is special. he has psychic abilities, after all. i mean, myles is special too, he can hear dead people, but i don't need an island-based explanation for that ability. i don't feel like they have to make some attempt to tie walt's ability into the larger island mythology or storyline either. to me, season 2 was all about the button, the dharma stuff, henry gale/ben linus, the tailies... i don't think walt was what season 2 was all about. maybe when i rewatch it i'll find it was emphasized more than i remember, but i'll also be watching it through the lens of knowing the end, so i imagine it will be easier to overlook. after all, it's well established that the others themselves didn't really understand the island or it's powers. i can chalk up their walt obsession to simply being mistaken about his importance.

let's face it though, we all know the real reason walt got written off the show - he grew up. if they made a mistake here, it was mostly in casting a kid of that age on the show to begin with.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Mon May 24, 2010 2:10 pm

so sorry wrote:Ben: so last week he "joins" NotLocke, and kills Widmore. We are led to believe that he is now Smokey's #2 (like Sayid was before him), killing whoever he says to kill. But we (the viewers) all figured he'd double cross Smokey in the end. Well, ben didn't get a chance to double cross NotLocke. So did he really go to the dark side, and come back again to ultimately help Jack and Hurley? Was his choice to join NotLocke a ruse that never got played out? (PS I really really thought it should have been Ben who shot NotLocke, not Kate).

Or did I miss something obvious (as per my usual :oops: )


i think that's what the walkie-talkies were for. i thought something was up in the previous episode when he took the walkie talkie and handed the other to myles. my guess is ben was going to be their "inside man" and let them know what smokey was up to.

i like the idea of ben shooting locke. that would've been a better way to go.


so sorry wrote:Desmond: when did NotLocke realize that Desmond was his key to destroying the island? Because if he knew all along, then why the fuck did he throw him down a well and ask Sayid to kill him?


Or did I miss something obvious (as per my usual :oops: ) Part II


widmore whispered it to him in the previous episode.
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