LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

The greatest TV in history is being made right now. The worst TV in history is being made right now.

How did you feel about the finale?

Loved it
10
38%
Liked it
6
23%
Disappointed
5
19%
Konged
5
19%
 
Total votes : 26

Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby so sorry on Mon May 24, 2010 2:12 pm

TheBaxter wrote:
so sorry wrote:Desmond: when did NotLocke realize that Desmond was his key to destroying the island? Because if he knew all along, then why the fuck did he throw him down a well and ask Sayid to kill him?


Or did I miss something obvious (as per my usual :oops: ) Part II


widmore whispered it to him in the previous episode.


Damn, forgot about that. So I guess NotLocke's first thought after that was "thank fucking Jeebus that Sayid double crossed me!"
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby Brit Pop on Mon May 24, 2010 6:04 pm

I only got back from a weekend away a few hours ago... and have watched the Lost finale...

I think it took longer to read all the Zoner comments than to watch it!

I havent really got anything to add just yet - I'm still trying to process my feelings about the episode.

So I'll watch it again and decide then!
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby Fried Gold on Mon May 24, 2010 6:20 pm

It was a perfect ending for the show and a wonderful way to bow out.

As they said in the episode - it was to remember and to let go.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby Bob Samonkey on Tue May 25, 2010 2:29 am

So Ill put my two cents in as well. I believe that the island was real.

I think that Kate and Sayer and Richard and Miles and Lipidus all got out and lived lives and died.

I think that Hurley and Ben may have lived for centuries after protecting the island

Then they all met up in the No-time Sideverse at different times and moved on together.

I really liked this show and I enjoyed the end as well. I would have liked more answers but I would also have liked the show to not end.

I did want to see the Hurley Bird though...
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby swoop91 on Tue May 25, 2010 6:27 am

Richard got his first gray, does that mean he's mortal?

I like that part alot. I liked most of meetings/rememberings, juliette/sawyer the most.

Island part was boohoo, fake part purgatory was nice most of time - hurley added to awesomeness
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby ironic name on Tue May 25, 2010 7:41 am

FRIED GOLD AVATAR WIN!
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby John-Locke on Tue May 25, 2010 8:07 am

I'm still reading peoples comments who think the whole thing was Purgatory, that everyone died in the crash and that it was all in Jacks head etc.

WRONG!
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby stereosforgeeks on Tue May 25, 2010 8:31 am

John-Locke wrote:I'm still reading peoples comments who think the whole thing was Purgatory, that everyone died in the crash and that it was all in Jacks head etc.

WRONG!


Yeah they made it pretty explicit.

I honestly really liked the ending. I wouldve liked more answers but we got a great sendoff to the characters and Im more than satisfied with that.

My fiancee went in thinking she was going to hate it (she watched it last night as she couldnt stay up) and ended up crying.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Tue May 25, 2010 9:25 am

John-Locke wrote:I'm still reading peoples comments who think the whole thing was Purgatory, that everyone died in the crash and that it was all in Jacks head etc.

WRONG!


yeah, i don't know where people got that from. were they not paying attention?

also, some people thought the shots of the beach wreckage over the credits meant that ajira 316 crashed after jack saw it fly overhead. WTF? i thought it was pretty obvious it was the original oceanic 815 wreckage, and those shots were just to sort of remember where the whole thing started from.

Bob Poopflingius Maximus wrote:So Ill put my two cents in as well. I believe that the island was real.

I think that Kate and Sayer and Richard and Miles and Lipidus all got out and lived lives and died.

I think that Hurley and Ben may have lived for centuries after protecting the island

Then they all met up in the No-time Sideverse at different times and moved on together.

I really liked this show and I enjoyed the end as well. I would have liked more answers but I would also have liked the show to not end.

I did want to see the Hurley Bird though...


yes, this is correct, and i too thought it was pretty explicitly stated. for a show that can often be vague and ambiguous, i didn't think there was any vagueness or ambiguity about these points.

the only "purgatory" was the sideways world. as christian definitively told jack, "everything on the island really happened". "there is no 'now' here." "everybody dies. some of them before you, and some long after." that pretty much spelled it out exactly. it was actually much more definitive than i think i was expecting based on the cuselof's comments heading up to the finale.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Tue May 25, 2010 9:27 am

swoop91 wrote:Richard got his first gray, does that mean he's mortal?


that's how i interpreted it. his first sign of aging in over a century. i'm glad richard DIDN'T go out like a punk after all.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby John-Locke on Tue May 25, 2010 9:42 am

Apart from the Juliet/Sawyer moment and the absolute perfection of Jacks dying moments my favourite bit of the finale was realising LAPIDUS LIVES! I seriously punched the air out of excitement, Fahey knows how to set up a surprise nicely. I'd read two Interviews with him after the Sub explosion episode

Q So, the question everyone wants to know, because the answer isn’t completely clear: Did Lapidus actually die in the last episode of Lost? I mean, we didn’t actually see him die…

A [Laughs] Well, he went down with the submarine. Yeah, he’s dead.

and in another one

"By the time they were filming the finale, I was in the Western Sahara. He’s dead now, the dream is over. I couldn’t overindulge where and what the fate of Lapidus was. He’s sitting somewhere at the bottom of the sea.”

Not even the slightest hint that he could return in either worlds. What a legend
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby Fried Gold on Tue May 25, 2010 9:52 am

...or maybe he was telling the truth and Lapidus is dead.

It was FAKE LAPIDUS that they found floating in the wreckage.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby ironic name on Tue May 25, 2010 10:02 am

Fried Gold wrote:...or maybe he was telling the truth and Lapidus is dead.

It was FAKE LAPIDUS that they found floating in the wreckage.

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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby swoop91 on Tue May 25, 2010 10:09 am

Fried gold, I was hoping Jack would yell to Flocke:

"You can not win, I've got the high ground!"
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby so sorry on Tue May 25, 2010 10:15 am

Oh man, how could I have forgotten the Jack-Jump-Punch! What an awesomely rediculous scene... jump punch to commercial... too fucking fun.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Tue May 25, 2010 10:31 am

so sorry wrote:Oh man, how could I have forgotten the Jack-Jump-Punch! What an awesomely rediculous scene... jump punch to commercial... too fucking fun.


yeah, it was like straight out of Troy, but he didn't have a sword.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby Fried Gold on Tue May 25, 2010 10:46 am

swoop91 wrote:Fried gold, I was hoping Jack would yell to Flocke:

"You can not win, I've got the high ground!"

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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby John-Locke on Tue May 25, 2010 10:50 am

It would have been far more BADASS if he'd given Locke a flying elbow to the head or flying knee to the face/chest Tony Jaa style
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby Fried Gold on Tue May 25, 2010 10:53 am

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Last edited by Fried Gold on Tue May 25, 2010 10:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Tue May 25, 2010 10:53 am

John-Locke wrote:It would have been far more BADASS if he'd given Locke a flying elbow to the head or flying knee to the face/chest Tony Jaa style


the funniest thing was, when they returned from commercial, didn't they show that jack's flying donkey punch basically missed the mark? nice to see that even after drinking the magic water and becoming new island guardian, jack can still occasionally manage to be a KNOB.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby captainbrose on Tue May 25, 2010 11:52 am

Im rereading this thread...Did some of you actually watch this show? Season 2 was all about Walt's story? Are you serious? Walt was a small blip on the radar of the show. He was in like 3 episodes of season 2.

The Losties were much more than a small piece of history on the Island. Hurley, an 815 passenger, is the new f'n leader of the Island for chrissakes.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby Jakester on Tue May 25, 2010 11:59 am

Okay, I've got a nagging question. have had since Chesty landed the Ajira plane.

How did The Others know to build the runway? I can't work out any scenario that actually makes sense.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby ironic name on Tue May 25, 2010 12:01 pm

my balls tingled at the jack attack.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby ironic name on Tue May 25, 2010 12:03 pm

and the only scene I nearly lost it in is Vincent laying down with Jack.
if you cried you are a sissy.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby Jakester on Tue May 25, 2010 12:10 pm

Okay, Season 2 wasn't all about Walt, but his kidnapping was a major catalyst to move large portions of the plot forward. That he was "special" was one of the big mysteries of the season, and Darlton just completely dropped it. I get that he aged, but in a world where a crippled guy can walk, a smoke monster assumes the form of dead people, tormented dead spirits whisper to the living, and a 2,000 year old guy guards a cave of glowing pee, Walt could have been aged by the Island "for some reason."
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby so sorry on Tue May 25, 2010 12:34 pm

captainbrose wrote:Im rereading this thread...Did some of you actually watch this show? Season 2 was all about Walt's story? Are you serious? Walt was a small blip on the radar of the show. He was in like 3 episodes of season 2.

Season 1 cliffhanger episode focused on Walt being abducted by the Others ("we're going to have to take the boy"-Tom). Season 2 spent tons of time with Michael hatching a plan to get off the island with Walt. He fucking shoots 2 Losties to do it, and the season cliffhanger shows him leaving the island with Walt as a trade off with Ben (giving Ben Kate/Sawyer/Jack/Hurley). Oh yeah, by the way, Walt mysteriously appears to other Losties in ghosty form telling them to do things. So yeah, I watched the show before, and yeah, I believe Walt was set up to be of major importance, but was dropped like a fucking stone when the real life actor shot up 10 inches in two year. Not even close to a "small blip on the radar of the show" at that point.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Tue May 25, 2010 1:12 pm

Jakester wrote:Okay, I've got a nagging question. have had since Chesty landed the Ajira plane.

How did The Others know to build the runway? I can't work out any scenario that actually makes sense.


most logical explanation i can think of: jacob told them to.

i was originally thinking that ben and the time-travelling might explain it... and maybe it does. but i can't think of a way off the top of my head.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Tue May 25, 2010 1:12 pm

ironic name wrote:and the only scene I nearly lost it in is Vincent laying down with Jack.
if you cried you are a sissy.


:(
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Tue May 25, 2010 1:18 pm

so sorry wrote:
captainbrose wrote:Im rereading this thread...Did some of you actually watch this show? Season 2 was all about Walt's story? Are you serious? Walt was a small blip on the radar of the show. He was in like 3 episodes of season 2.

Season 1 cliffhanger episode focused on Walt being abducted by the Others ("we're going to have to take the boy"-Tom). Season 2 spent tons of time with Michael hatching a plan to get off the island with Walt. He fucking shoots 2 Losties to do it, and the season cliffhanger shows him leaving the island with Walt as a trade off with Ben (giving Ben Kate/Sawyer/Jack/Hurley). Oh yeah, by the way, Walt mysteriously appears to other Losties in ghosty form telling them to do things. So yeah, I watched the show before, and yeah, I believe Walt was set up to be of major importance, but was dropped like a fucking stone when the real life actor shot up 10 inches in two year. Not even close to a "small blip on the radar of the show" at that point.


i get that he was important to that season. but outside of that one appearance of Big Walt to locke, i don't see a dangling thread, or anything in his storyline that required resolving, or being tied into the larger mythology of the island. you know, season 2 cliffhanger was two guys in an arctic station detecting the island. do we need to find out what happened to those guys too for the series to have sufficient resolution?
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Tue May 25, 2010 1:26 pm

btw, i went and read the portion of the TBs from the finale while it was airing. first, i feel really sorry for all those people whose lives will be so empty now that Lost has gone off the air... because they'll no longer have anything to bitch and complain about. it must be a sad existence to spend 121 hours of your life watching a show you hate, just so you can post about how terrible it is on the internet.

the funniest though are the ones who couldn't even understand the ending and thought the WHOLE SHOW had been purgatory. they're all complaining about how stupid the writers are and how dumb anyone who likes the show must be, and THEY DON'T EVEN UNDERSTAND A VERY CLEARLY EXPLAINED ENDING.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby so sorry on Tue May 25, 2010 1:30 pm

TheBaxter wrote:
so sorry wrote:
captainbrose wrote:Im rereading this thread...Did some of you actually watch this show? Season 2 was all about Walt's story? Are you serious? Walt was a small blip on the radar of the show. He was in like 3 episodes of season 2.

Season 1 cliffhanger episode focused on Walt being abducted by the Others ("we're going to have to take the boy"-Tom). Season 2 spent tons of time with Michael hatching a plan to get off the island with Walt. He fucking shoots 2 Losties to do it, and the season cliffhanger shows him leaving the island with Walt as a trade off with Ben (giving Ben Kate/Sawyer/Jack/Hurley). Oh yeah, by the way, Walt mysteriously appears to other Losties in ghosty form telling them to do things. So yeah, I watched the show before, and yeah, I believe Walt was set up to be of major importance, but was dropped like a fucking stone when the real life actor shot up 10 inches in two year. Not even close to a "small blip on the radar of the show" at that point.


i get that he was important to that season. but outside of that one appearance of Big Walt to locke, i don't see a dangling thread, or anything in his storyline that required resolving, or being tied into the larger mythology of the island. you know, season 2 cliffhanger was two guys in an arctic station detecting the island. do we need to find out what happened to those guys too for the series to have sufficient resolution?


Nah that's a bad example. The two guys in the arctic statin had nothing to do with the ongoing plot. They were there for, what, 5 minutes of screen time total? Not the same situation as Walt.

All I've been trying to say regarding Walt is that I think he was going to be something more integral to the show, but for real world reasons they wrote him out (or more accurately, just stopped writing him in!). I think they could have tied Walt back into the story somehow this season, that's all.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby Lord Voldemoo on Tue May 25, 2010 1:30 pm

Overall, I found the finale to be very satisfying. It's taken a couple of days for me to write about it because I've been busy, and honestly I wanted to give it a day or two to sink in.

I loved the idea of the sideways-flashes being "purgatory". It worked with the storyline and was, I thought, a pretty funny in-jokey kind of way to nod at the viewers who have been theorizing for 6 years that the ISLAND is purgatory. No, no it is not, but the rest of it was! Or at least "the rest of it" in this season.

Sure, I still have questions. I guess I come down more on the side of those who are saying that the questions remaining were heavily outweighed by the answers we got. And let's face it, if they tried to answer every single question those who are complaining now would instead be claiming that the thread tightening at the end was too convenient. The biggest remaining specific long-term questions that I can think of are Walt and babies.

For some reason I'm just having a lot of trouble caring that much about what the nature of Walt's powers were at this point. It would have been nice to address it, and it probably could have been brushed off by some cryptic statement by Jacob around the campfire, but they didn't go there. Not sure if it slipped their minds, or if they wanted to leave a little mystery, or if they didn't want to give it short-shrift and so decided to leave it open? Regardless of the reason, I wasn't left at the end wondering "WHAT WAS THE DEAL WITH WALT?!?" I honestly didn't even really think of him until I read the thread in here. But maybe that's just me.

As for babies, why couldn't they be born on the Island? Someone mentioned the electro-magnetism. I guess that works. But what about Aaron? Why were the Others so obsessed with kids? In the quest to find the Replacement? As it turns out, adults are fine too. Was this answered somehow? I need to rewatch the whole series, I guess, lol. No babies were born between Jacob/MIB and then Aaron on the Island, right? Was Aaron just a red herring? I always assumed he had some additional relevance. This one bothers me a little more than the Walt questions (though it may tie back to them). Is there clarity here that I'm missing? I've never gone back and re-watched eps, and I don't read tons of analysis on the show, so I feel like I'm probably missing something.

There were broader questions which were left more or less unresolved. Some core to the mythology. What is the Island, really? I know it's a plug, holding back evil, what is the nature of that evil? Is it hell? I guess it's something like that. Everybody in the church seemed pretty happy going on to whatever version of Heaven that they were heading too, so I guess there must be a Yin to that Yang. They did enough there, I felt, and didn't need to over-analyze it, as further analysis would have ended up being colored by one religious doctrine or another. Whatever it is, it's really bad, and the island holds it in check. That's probably enough.

What happened to Not-Locke after the Plug was pulled by Desmond? Obviously he seemed as though he lost some or all of his power, so was his power tied to the Island and not to whatever it was holding back? That part didn't make sense to me, and was the biggest problem I had with the finale. If the plug holding back the evil is released, and the water drains, you would think that NotLocke would become more powerful, not less. Or at least the same. If NotLocke's powers were somehow diminished/eliminated, did it matter anymore if he got off the Island? Should Jack have just ignored him and gone straight down into the cave? If Jack replaced the Plug without killing NotLocke first, would NotLocke's powers come back? There may have been indicators as to why these things were the way that they were, but if so I missed them (I need to re-watch that part).

So the final duel between Jack and NotLocke, while awesome, was the part of the finale that confused me the most. I'd appreciate people's thoughts there.

One other choice I didn't like, which has been mentioned: Sayid and Shannon. That was lame. As people have said, Nadia got screwed. A few people have mentioned that Ben should have shot NotLocke, not Kate. I don't really care that it was Kate, but I thought that it was great that it WASN'T Ben. First of all, it would have been too obvious. Second of all, it was messaged throughout the finale: Ben is NOT Special. He's the #2, not the Hero. It has always just been a question of whether Ben would accept that role.

Overall, though, I really enjoyed this. It was a great ride. And I stand by what I said on Friday about the show remaining thematically consistent throughout, from the Pilot to the Finale. From John Lock playing backgammon on the Beach next to the still-smoking plane and telling Walt it's about light vs. dark, to the final fight between the personification of each.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby John-Locke on Tue May 25, 2010 1:36 pm

We got some form of Walt closure when Locke was back off the island, all we don't know is what The Others wanted him for. Maybe he used his powers to get Lockes Dad onto the Island, maybe (probably) not. Who knows. In the grand scheme of things it's as inconsequential as what happened to the so called Sheriff of The Others (I think she interrogated Kate on Hydra Island) or the ex-wife of Goodwin (was that a Ghost Juliet saw in season wud? 4 or 5) or Cindy & the children...

You could pick holes in the show like how did Smokey appear to Jack (as his Father) in the Hospital, how he appeared to Locke down by the Donkey Wheel in a time period probably before he had access to Christians body, who was in the cabin etc. etc...

On the whole Lost has always had loose threads but the sum of all the parts that do work are why we all enjoy the show so much. I've never read or heard anyone claim the show was perfect, I don't see why suddenly so many people expected the finale to achieve so much it was clearly never going to even try.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Tue May 25, 2010 1:56 pm

John-Locke wrote:On the whole Lost has always had loose threads but the sum of all the parts that do work are why we all enjoy the show so much. I've never read or heard anyone claim the show was perfect, I don't see why suddenly so many people expected the finale to achieve so much it was clearly never going to even try.


i think that's the main thing for me. a lot of the disappointment for those who were disappointed came from having unrealistically high expectations. Lost is definitely not perfect; it's flawed, just like all the characters on the show. but i think it's a remarkable achievement, given the constraints they worked within, given the nature of network TV, and the timeframe over which the show aired (over 6 years!) that they were able to make it as consistently good and have as satisfying a finish as it did. one of my greatest fears over the course of the show was that some important actor would die or something, and force the show to veer off in a different unintended direction. or the creators would get replaced by somebody who turned it into something really shitty. luckily none of that happened, but they did still have to deal with not knowing how long the show would air for the first half of it's existence, a child actor growing up, another unhappy actor leaving the series before they intended that character to leave, and so on. given that, i think what they managed to achieve with the show was quite remarkable. would it have been better if it had all been planned and written out from the very beginning and held to only 3 or 4 seasons long? absolutely, but unfortunately there probably aren't many places available where you could make a show like that.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby so sorry on Tue May 25, 2010 2:04 pm

Let me restate that despite being let down a bit in the end, and having many many more questions that I would have like to have answered, I still love(d) this show for 6 seasons. It had its ups and downs for sure, but over the long haul it was an awesome experience. And on a personal level it really cemented the Zone as part of my daily routine too.... those first few years of LOST/Zone go hand in hand for me.

So yeah, I wanted more, was let down personally, but can't knock this show at all. I put it right up there as one of the top shows in all of my tv watching years.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby ironic name on Tue May 25, 2010 2:19 pm

TheBaxter wrote:
ironic name wrote:and the only scene I nearly lost it in is Vincent laying down with Jack.
if you cried you are a sissy.


:(

or not unable to feel.
either way.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby John-Locke on Tue May 25, 2010 2:39 pm

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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby ironic name on Tue May 25, 2010 2:55 pm

win.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby so sorry on Tue May 25, 2010 3:01 pm



"How gross was hurley eating the tub of ranch dressing?"

I think that one answers itself!

EDIT: I know that was a semi-joke thing, but actually lots of my questions are the same! Although LOTS of the answers were kinda answered already.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby sonnyboo on Tue May 25, 2010 3:32 pm

John-Locke wrote:the ex-wife of Goodwin (was that a Ghost Juliet saw in season wud? 4 or 5)

You could pick holes in the show like how did Smokey appear to Jack (as his Father) in the Hospital, how he appeared to Locke down by the Donkey Wheel in a time period probably before he had access to Christians body, who was in the cabin etc. etc...


Yeah, there is a lot still going on with dead people and who can and cannot see them on and off the island.

Smokey, if he was trapped in Locke's body as Illyana stated so clearly, then how did he turn into Ben's daughter when he returned to the island as fake Locke? How did he appear as Christian Shepard and Libby to Michael in NYC in a hospital and on the boat way off shore? And if so, why was he doing Jacob's bidding? Also, the commentaries clearly stated the with Nikki and Paulo, that the Smoke Monster was involved in their being buried, as you can clearly hear the smoke monster mechanical sounds when the spiders appear to bite them.

MiB saw his mother appear to him as a child, the same as Ben had his dead mother appear to him on the island. How and why to dead people appear to some and not others? Richard clearly states he never saw anyone come back from the dead. How John Locke's father got on the island, if that was in fact him and not Smokey, although I think it was really MiB because when Ben alludes to a "magic box" that he later claims was metaphorical, I think he summoned the smoke monster to do this.

I believe the intent is that everything on the island was "real" and the flash sideways was meant to be a form of purgatory, but similarly I truly believe this was just a TV production and writing thing to be a "surprise" and twist, not because of any preconceived plan or intent from day one. Former co-executive producer David Fury (a Team Whedon vet and also moved on to 24 as a writer/producer) said there was no plan and that those guys were full of shit in a Rolling Stone interview in 2004-2005. In the same vein, I think they originally intended the island to be purgatory, but because so many people guessed it, they went sci-fi with the story solely to be less predictable instead of being meaningful.

I loved the first 5 seasons of LOST. This 6th season was a bit of a disappointment, and almost entirely for the flash-sideways stories. I feel going entirely spiritual after dancing in the science fiction pool for so long and adding some fantasy elements, was just too much genre bending for one show, as I found it hard to adhere to the different storytelling rules of each genre without betraying the audience (me) too much. It's just too much to handle all the different elements of Sci Fi - Fantasy - Spiritual all wrapped up without negating some aspects of these.

Again, this was how the writers felt they could get around bringing back people they killed off to give closure to their stories, but also not break a rule they set up for themselves (as if they hadn't broken their own rules many times over) of not having things change in the space time continuum, as in "whatever happened, happened". I think they could have had Desmond go back in time, as he had before at least his consciousness, and change things, like he thought he could. I think the writers thought this too obvious so they changed it to purgatory just to be contrite and have a "twist". Also, how did Desmond get to see the AFTERLIFE and how did this experiment that sent his consciousness back in time suddenly awaken his after-life self at a specific moment in "time", when there is no time in the afterlife? I think that is evidence that the writers were looking for a twist for twisty sake and not for a predetermined reason.

I don't hate the finale, but the entire last season is diminished for me, and greatly, at least compared to the rest of the show as a whole.

I can't be the only one who felt like the entire Jacob/MiB episode was like a cheap BEASTMASTER episode...
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby DerLanghaarige on Tue May 25, 2010 4:02 pm

NOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREAD

Can I ask everybody to not put spoilers (as in animated scenes from the finale) into their avatar's and signatures? I was okay with it when it happened after the BSG finale, because I don't care for BSG, but the Lost finale won't air here before July and so far I tried everything to avoid spoilers. I even wasn't on Twitter since Sunday night and won't sign in before tomorrow.
So I got no idea if there are any animated Lost finale avatars or sigs running on here, but I would like to ask everybody to put them away for a while in favour of the unlucky foreigners who haven't seen it yet.
Thank you.

NOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREAD
(I alwo won't read any replies to this post on here, because they are in a spoiler thread, so feel free to say the most horrible things about me on here, but keep in mind that I might read them in July.)
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Tue May 25, 2010 4:10 pm

i think the "visions" are the hardest question on the show to resolve. especially since (as that video reminds us) some of the visions aren't of dead people, and some aren't even of people at all (kate's horse). and the show has given us several possible explanations for each: manifestations of smokey, actual ghosts trapped on the island, psychic projections, jacob visions, and so on. but figuring out WHICH explanation applies to each individual vision is something we are left to do ourselves. the visions are a more important question than stuff like walt or the dharma package drop, because the visions were in EVERY season and often involved people telling various characters what to do or otherwise directly influencing the course of events.

i also tend to think there's another explanation the show never gave us, which is that some visions were manufactured by the island itself, perhaps as a self-preservation mechanism. that's the explanation i'm going to use for the visions that can't be explained any other way, for example, big walt appearing to locke, christian shephard appearing off island, claire (who was still alive) appearing to kate, and so on. (claire could also have been a psychic projection from crazy claire, still left behind on the island, somehow amplified by the island). it's not perfect, but it'll have to do.

sonnyboo wrote:Smokey, if he was trapped in Locke's body as Illyana stated so clearly, then how did he turn into Ben's daughter when he returned to the island as fake Locke? How did he appear as Christian Shepard and Libby to Michael in NYC in a hospital and on the boat way off shore? And if so, why was he doing Jacob's bidding? Also, the commentaries clearly stated the with Nikki and Paulo, that the Smoke Monster was involved in their being buried, as you can clearly hear the smoke monster mechanical sounds when the spiders appear to bite them.


the reigning theory, which makes sense to me, is that locke wasn't "trapped" in that form until after he killed jacob. before then, he could appear as alex or any other (dead) person he wanted. makes sense to me. all the off-island visions would have to be either jacob visions (maybe he can take other forms in his visions too) or my guess, island-created visions. i never listened to any commentaries, but i wouldn't take that stuff as canon, any more than fahey's talk about how lapidus died in the sub explosion.

sonnyboo wrote:How John Locke's father got on the island, if that was in fact him and not Smokey, although I think it was really MiB because when Ben alludes to a "magic box" that he later claims was metaphorical, I think he summoned the smoke monster to do this.


my belief at the time, before the story went all supernatural (and i still believe it) is that the others simply kidnapped locke's dad and brought him to the island. we know they had the ability to come and go from the island whenever they wanted. all the "magic box" talk was just ben's way of playing on locke's island faith to manipulate him.

sonnyboo wrote:In the same vein, I think they originally intended the island to be purgatory, but because so many people guessed it, they went sci-fi with the story solely to be less predictable instead of being meaningful.


that's my theory, though i wouldn't hold it against them. i mean, if you are creating this big mystery show, and then people guess the big secret right from the start, aren't you kind of forced to change it up then? i actually think the way they used the flashsideways in the final season to bring the idea back and probably to execute an ending that somewhat resembled what they may have initially had in mind was pretty clever.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TheBaxter on Tue May 25, 2010 4:13 pm

DerLanghaarige wrote:NOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREAD

Can I ask everybody to not put spoilers (as in animated scenes from the finale) into their avatar's and signatures? I was okay with it when it happened after the BSG finale, because I don't care for BSG, but the Lost finale won't air here before July and so far I tried everything to avoid spoilers. I even wasn't on Twitter since Sunday night and won't sign in before tomorrow.
So I got no idea if there are any animated Lost finale avatars or sigs running on here, but I would like to ask everybody to put them away for a while in favour of the unlucky foreigners who haven't seen it yet.
Thank you.

NOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREAD
(I alwo won't read any replies to this post on here, because they are in a spoiler thread, so feel free to say the most horrible things about me on here, but keep in mind that I might read them in July.)


wow. july? i could NOT wait that long. you must have incredible willpower.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby so sorry on Tue May 25, 2010 4:18 pm

TheBaxter wrote:
DerLanghaarige wrote:NOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREAD

Can I ask everybody to not put spoilers (as in animated scenes from the finale) into their avatar's and signatures? I was okay with it when it happened after the BSG finale, because I don't care for BSG, but the Lost finale won't air here before July and so far I tried everything to avoid spoilers. I even wasn't on Twitter since Sunday night and won't sign in before tomorrow.
So I got no idea if there are any animated Lost finale avatars or sigs running on here, but I would like to ask everybody to put them away for a while in favour of the unlucky foreigners who haven't seen it yet.
Thank you.

NOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREAD
(I alwo won't read any replies to this post on here, because they are in a spoiler thread, so feel free to say the most horrible things about me on here, but keep in mind that I might read them in July.)


wow. july? i could NOT wait that long. you must have incredible willpower.


Or can't find the right bittorrent to get it from! Kidding internet Gestapo people!





Anywho, just realized that we had a poll for the last episode:

Who will be the last LOSTie to die?

Boy, they sure answered THAT question, didn't they!
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby Brit Pop on Tue May 25, 2010 4:19 pm

If you have ever read the last Dark Tower book... Steven King stops the story, and basically tells you that you can stop reading at that point because if you read further you may get pissed of with the ending.

I'll freely admit I didnt like the purgatory bit of the Lost finale, if there had been none of the flashes in season 6... and just the Island stuff happened... and Jack died in the bamboo watching his friends escape - I would have been very satisfied with what I'd seen.

But as we know, the flashbacks & flashforwards were an essential part of the Lost storytelling engine - the writers upped their game with the switch to flashforwards, Jacks beard being what fooled everyone into not realising we were seeing the future until 'the big reveal' of Kate driving up to him.

So the writers probably wondered how they could up the game again - instead of FB's or FF's... how about purgatory - I never really twigged until the Jack / Christian conversation, although when Jin & Sun syncro-remembered their own drownings I had a feeling.

A few of my gripes with flash-purgatory...

* Jacks son as a figment.
* Charlie being the insigator of the rememberance... then seemingly forgetting again.
* All those who got off the Island probably re-married and had happy lives, where were their other halves?
* Was Michael doomed to wander the Island for eternity as a whispering ghost?

Lost has been a great show, my number one for 6 cliffhanger laden years - I'm happy with how it ended...

But I choose to not acknowledge the purgatory - as far as I'm concerned it ended with Jacks eye closing - if you catch my drift.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby swoop91 on Tue May 25, 2010 5:04 pm

so sorry wrote:
TheBaxter wrote:
DerLanghaarige wrote:NOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREAD

Can I ask everybody to not put spoilers (as in animated scenes from the finale) into their avatar's and signatures? I was okay with it when it happened after the BSG finale, because I don't care for BSG, but the Lost finale won't air here before July and so far I tried everything to avoid spoilers. I even wasn't on Twitter since Sunday night and won't sign in before tomorrow.
So I got no idea if there are any animated Lost finale avatars or sigs running on here, but I would like to ask everybody to put them away for a while in favour of the unlucky foreigners who haven't seen it yet.
Thank you.

NOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREADNOTREADINGTHETHREAD
(I alwo won't read any replies to this post on here, because they are in a spoiler thread, so feel free to say the most horrible things about me on here, but keep in mind that I might read them in July.)


wow. july? i could NOT wait that long. you must have incredible willpower.


Or can't find the right bittorrent to get it from! Kidding internet Gestapo people!





Anywho, just realized that we had a poll for the last episode:

Who will be the last LOSTie to die?

Boy, they sure answered THAT question, didn't they!


Facepalm, just frakking dl the episode.

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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby RogueScribner on Tue May 25, 2010 8:41 pm

I missed the finale when it aired because on Sunday I drove from Missouri to Virginia (just outside of D.C.) for a funeral. Monday morning I went to said funeral, then drove all the way back home. I slept, woke up, and watched Lost. Maybe because I was a bit of an emotional bastard anyway due to the events of the past couple of days, but the finale hit me hard. I freely admit I was tearing up and sniffly at the end. I don't think I fully understand everything, but emotionally, I was satisfied. I'll have to rewatch parts of the series and maybe look some stuff up on Lostpedia to fill in some blanks, but I thought the finale was touching and struck the perfect end note. It was sad in some ways, but uplifting in others. Jack finally learned to have a little faith and he ended up saving the very thing he desperately wanted away from: the island. The island gave him and everyone else the peace they couldn't find back home. Any bits of closure the characters needed they worked out in the sideways world. Life is messy, everything is never tied up with a pretty little bow. I never expected the show to play any differently.

There's still some stuff I'm trying to wrap my brain around, but I do know that I'll miss Jack, Kate, Hurley, Sawyer, John, Jin, Sun, Charlie, Juliette, Ben, Rose, Bernard, and everyone else. They entertained me and their successes and failures were my successes and failures. All those little reconciliations and remembrances in the finale killed me. I felt especially good about Ben, which I never would have predicted early on. He's probably still a bastard, but he's an enlightened bastard. And John didn't even hold a grudge. Of course he didn't. I just wish we got a peek into Ben being Hurley's number two. :wink:

Lost was far from perfect television, but it was still great. I didn't realize how much I loved some of these characters and they were gone.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby King Of Nowhere on Wed May 26, 2010 5:46 am

The lost version of purgatory made every character the same in the end & for a show that i keep getting told "it's all about the characters", that doesn't really work for me. The whole idea of purgatory is kinda to make you plain, free of your flaws & ready for Heaven. It doesn't really work to show people paying for their past sins by living out reasonably nice lives. Kate, Jin & Sayid all killed people in their non island lives & then went on to kill some more once they reached the island, but they get little punishment. Kate only gets taken to jail for a few hours. Sure, Sayid can't be with his true love, but wait, the need to show "the gang's all here" made Shannon his true love & he found spiritual peace by, erm, saving her from a fake fight.

Then you've got Ben, a guy who was shown to commit genocide. The only bad thing that happened to him was Des hitting him a little & the failure to get the Principal's job via blackmail. That could be a reason for Ben not being ready to move on, as he's only recently discovered his evil potential & hasn't made up for the things he did while he was alive, but we were shown Sayid learning that he can't escape being a killer & he didn't have to pay for what he did before entering heaven. Having Ben turn down the chance to move on was bullshit. You can't do "the gang's all here for a purpose" without having all of the gang serve it. They even have Shannon in the church, showing that the most important thing she ever did in her life was fucking about on an island for two weeks, she realises it & gets to move on. If, like Christian said, Jack needed everyone to help him move on & they all needed each other, Ben should've been in the room.

Miles was shown to be tracking down Des, Sayid & Kate, but he didn't get the memo about the party. His partner, Sawyer, could've phoned him up, told him "you better come down here" & that way Miles would've been able to move on as well. Instead of showing 3 seconds of Sawyer on the phone, or just having him on the phone in the background of a scene & then having Miles sitting in the church with everyone else, they decided to make a plot hole.

The other thing that bothered me is that they have people of all religions hanging around in a Christian (most likely catholic) purgatory. I get that the writers didn't want to say "x religion is the one we're displaying" & that's why we see people going to the party/concert & then to Christian's funeral, but that only works as far as tricking the characters into going to the church, not for say, Sayid, to be in purgatory in the first place. Purgatory comes across more as Jack's dying fantasy, or at least a version of purgatory created solely for himself, than anything else.

Other than that, i liked it. The first 2 hours were fantastic. I didn't have any questions i wanted them to answer & just wanted to see how they'd rap the story up. They did a good job with all the on-island stuff.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby TonyWilson on Wed May 26, 2010 6:06 am

It's not exactly purgatory, certainly nothing notionally denominational. As Christian said it's a place they created, not that God created and I think it was created as a parallel universe with the combination of the explosion of Jughead and what the Losties present for that event all really wanted (The Light seems to give form to dreams and delusions after all). Now in my opinion they kinda fumbled the end by having them all meet in the Universalist Church and "move on" when what should have happened is they lived on in the parallel universe with all their memories of the original universe intact.
I'm still rolling the whole thing round my and I really don't know where I stand on the finale, I'll say this though, Across The Sea was pretty awful.
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Re: LOST SEASON 6 (SPOILERS)

Postby RogueScribner on Wed May 26, 2010 6:50 am

The more I think about it, the more I'm not sure how I feel about the purgatory ending. I mean, I get why they would have gone that route, but I wonder if there wasn't a better way to accomplish the same goal? If everyone actually got a second chance at life after the sacrifices they made on/for the island, that'd be something. And I guess in a way, they did, except they were really dead and once everyone realized who they really were, they "moved on." So yeah, the last 5 to 10 minutes of non-island stuff is a little confusing to me. The island stuff was great, and the non-island stuff until the very end was great, but the more I think about the very end, the more I'm not sure about it. It was great seeing everyone together, and I guess everyone got a happy ending, but what did it all really mean? The purgatory was part wish fulfillment, part self-flagellation, and part working their way through baggage. When everyone was finally able to let everything go, they moved on. I read that last sentence and think I get it, but I don't feel I get it.

Gargh.

There are two conflicting sides to this. Emotionally the episode rocked, but intellectually the more I think about it the more questions I have. It's probably best to just let it go and maybe check out the DVD when it streets so I can gain some further insight. I have a feeling the ending is going to be a source of debate for a long while.
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