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Ricardo Montalban's fine corinthian pecs.... NOW WITH POLL!

PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 5:04 pm
by Adam Balm
MOD EDIT: This was split off from the X3 thread. -AB

King Psyz wrote:I appologize for the hackneyed special effects, there's only so much I can do on a underpowered work computer with ms paint.

Still looks better than Vinnie Jones faux stomach though...


Hey, you don't know if that's fake. Hell, up until this year I was convinced Khaaaaaannnn's chest was a prosthetic. But that's 100% real Montalban there.

PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 5:15 pm
by DennisMM
Adam Balm wrote:
King Psyz wrote:I appologize for the hackneyed special effects, there's only so much I can do on a underpowered work computer with ms paint.

Still looks better than Vinnie Jones faux stomach though...


Hey, you don't know if that's fake. Hell, up until this year I was convinced Khaaaaaannnn's chest was a prosthetic. But that's 100% real Montalban there.


That's not what I've heard. Where did you find this info? Honestly interested.

PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 5:17 pm
by King Psyz
Adam Balm wrote:
King Psyz wrote:I appologize for the hackneyed special effects, there's only so much I can do on a underpowered work computer with ms paint.

Still looks better than Vinnie Jones faux stomach though...


Hey, you don't know if that's fake. Hell, up until this year I was convinced Khaaaaaannnn's chest was a prosthetic. But that's 100% real Montalban there.

no way! I'm convinced it's a plastic shell still.

PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 6:04 pm
by Adam Balm
Well, on the Wrath of Khan commentary, Nicholas Meyer (or the person he was talking with) claimed it was all real. Supposedly Ricardo Montalban was a fitness nut or something. I dunno..

PostPosted: Thu Apr 13, 2006 7:35 pm
by DennisMM
I don't have the SE DVD or even the vanilla DVD. Should have, but don't. Rented it but didn't listen to the whole commentary.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 8:55 am
by unikrunk
Adam Balm wrote:Well, on the Wrath of Khan commentary, Nicholas Meyer (or the person he was talking with) claimed it was all real. Supposedly Ricardo Montalban was a fitness nut or something. I dunno..


This can not be true. The guy was, like, 70. What kind of Jack Lalanne shit was he up to? And why was he smaller on TOS than in TWOK, 20 years later?

Jack
Image

Monty
Image

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 9:36 am
by The Ginger Man
Looks pretty real to me.

Image

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 9:45 am
by unikrunk
The Ginger Man wrote:Looks pretty real to me.

Image


My sarcasometer is broken. Are you serious?

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 10:28 am
by The Ginger Man
unikrunk wrote:
The Ginger Man wrote:Looks pretty real to me.



My sarcasometer is broken. Are you serious?


Yeah, I'm serious. I think the reason his chest looks plastic is b/c Ricardo looks plastic....look at his face, those arms. And notice he's kinda leaning forward. Those pecs are doing some old man boob saggage.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 10:36 am
by Adam Balm
The Ginger Man wrote:Looks pretty real to me.

Image


They look like they're made of fine corinthian leather...

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 10:41 am
by thomasgaffney
Adam Balm wrote:
The Ginger Man wrote:Looks pretty real to me.

Image


They look like they're made of fine corinthian leather...


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! ipampilash!!

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 10:59 am
by so sorry
The Ginger Man wrote:
Image


Image

i heard Tina had plastic boobs made for this role...

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 11:08 am
by raasnio
They're real, imo. I may not give him much credit because I think he's cheesy (like Charles Bronson), but he was just in great shape.

As someone stated, Montalban doesn't look quite right. It's probably the way his skin looks.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:01 pm
by austenandrews
I never understood why people thought his chest was a fake. I can only figure the roundness of his "neckline" gave the illusion of a prosthetic, or something.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:06 pm
by Lady Sheridan
The skin tone and texture matches too well. It's real. Even with lighting you couldn't disguise the texture. You can also see his sternum in that second pic--how the heck would you form a fake sternum?

It's only in recent years that prosthetics have come far enough to blend in that well. And I'm still not sure if they have the capability to do an entire chest prosthetic.

I have seen older guys in that good of shape before, it's not completely unknown, particularly if they've got Hollywood trainers and such.

But I'd have to see the movie again to judge.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:07 pm
by unikrunk
austenandrews wrote:I never understood why people thought his chest was a fake. I can only figure the roundness of his "neckline" gave the illusion of a prosthetic, or something.


Let me help explain why I know it is fake; watch the movie, and look for any sub dermal movement in his chest or biceps. You will find none.

People, they are not real, it is a body suit. Jesus, if he was in that good of shape, he would not have the fucking neck waddles of a 100 year old turkey going on.

Also, please see my post of TOS pic of Monty. No titties. No ceps.

/Still wearing a rug though.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:14 pm
by Lady Sheridan
Well, your neck does not have alot of f@t or muscle, so it's going to sag. There's no real way to tighten your neck, other than some kind of plastic surgery. Being in good shape does not completely erase the aging process.

Look at older actresses, such as Goldie Hawn--who would argue she was in bad shape for her age? I bet she's pretty toned. But her neck and chest really betray her age.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:17 pm
by Adam Balm
Lady Sheridan wrote:
I have seen older guys in that good of shape before, it's not completely unknown, particularly if they've got Hollywood trainers and such.


And look at his biceps. Thick as hell with veins popping out. That either means in shape, or a smack user...

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:18 pm
by unikrunk
Lady Sheridan wrote:Well, your neck does not have alot of f@t or muscle, so it's going to sag. There's no real way to tighten your neck, other than some kind of plastic surgery. Being in good shape does not completely erase the aging process.

Look at older actresses, such as Goldie Hawn--who would argue she was in bad shape for her age? I bet she's pretty toned. But her neck and chest really betray her age.


I will concede that you are correct on the neck droopage.

But what about the lack of sub dermal activity? Watch the movie again, and you will see what I am speaking of. When he lifts Chekhov off the floor, there is ZERO movement in his chest. It's impossible; when raising your arms the chest and back muscles tighten. When Monty does it, nothing happens at all. Also, the color is too uniform, and hairless. You know Monty is one hirsute bastard. Even if shaved (which is a really nasty thought), he would still have some stubble.

Also, please see any episode of Fantasy Island.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:18 pm
by unikrunk
Adam Balm wrote:
Lady Sheridan wrote:
I have seen older guys in that good of shape before, it's not completely unknown, particularly if they've got Hollywood trainers and such.


And look at his biceps. Thick as hell with veins popping out. That either means in shape, or a smack user...


um...or molded plastic.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:22 pm
by Adam Balm
unikrunk wrote: Even if shaved (which is a really nasty thought), he would still have some stubble.



Yes. Because they haven't invented razors that can tackle the technological hurdle of stubble. I'm sure they'll fix that as soon as they can invent make up ladies to apply foundation to even out the skin tone which has been common practice in hollywood for nearly a century.

EDIT: Oh, and btw, I agree with you on the lifting checkov thing. I just did the motion like twenty times and even if you're not using any effort, your pec muscles still move.

EDIT #2: Unless he was already flexing in that scene. I wouldn't be surprised if Montalban was purposely flexing them in most shots. If you try it with your chest muscles already flexed, they will appear not to move or tense at all.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:23 pm
by unikrunk
Adam Balm wrote:
unikrunk wrote: Even if shaved (which is a really nasty thought), he would still have some stubble.



Yes. Because they haven't invented razors that can tackle the technological hurdle of stubble. I'm sure they'll fix that as soon as they can invent make up ladies to apply foundation to even out the skin tone which has been common practice in hollywood for nearly a century.

EDIT: Oh, and btw, I agree with you on the lifting checkov thing. I just did the motion like twenty times and even if you're not using any effort, your pec muscles still move.


Well, we are speaking of the days of yore, before advancements such as the Quattro or Fusion... :)

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:32 pm
by unikrunk
His chest is as real as Pamela Anderson's. If it's not a prosthetic, it's implants.

/that is fucking gross. Monty's implants...ewwwww

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:33 pm
by Lady Sheridan
Waxing would explain the lack of stubble. Look at all those pretty boys in 300--completely waxed!

I just don't think they had the capability for that kind of prosthetic. It's only been in the last 10 years or so they have really made some breakthroughs with silicone and latex. Body-casting is a relatively new technique.

There's no "cut off" line that gives it away as a suit...as Adam Balm pointed out, his arms match.
If it was a suit, there's no end line at his neck or wrists. The veins wouldn't match up.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:34 pm
by TheBaxter
unikrunk wrote:Also, the color is too uniform, and hairless. You know Monty is one hirsute bastard. Even if shaved (which is a really nasty thought), he would still have some stubble.


Maybe he waxes...

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:35 pm
by unikrunk
Lady Sheridan wrote:Waxing would explain the lack of stubble. Look at all those pretty boys in 300--completely waxed!

I just don't think they had the capability for that kind of prosthetic. It's only been in the last 10 years or so they have really made some breakthroughs with silicone and latex. Body-casting is a relatively new technique.

There's no "cut off" line that gives it away as a suit...as Adam Balm pointed out, his arms match.
If it was a suit, there's no end line at his neck or wrists. The veins wouldn't match up.


WAXY300LOVEILASH

Madame, methinks 300 has given you a case of the vapors :D

I humbly disagree that the prosthetics could not be done in 1982. Also, I am stuck on the lack of muscle movement throughout the film.

/Waxy!

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:36 pm
by TheBaxter
I don't see what difference a comparison between Khan Ricardo and TOS Ricardo, or even Fantasy Island Ricardo, makes... maybe he pulled a Christian Bale and bulked up especially for the role. Compare Machinist Christian Bale to Batman Christian Bale, less than a year later.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:36 pm
by Lady Sheridan
I can't believe I am arguing this...but hey, I'm on the clock so why not... ;)

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:37 pm
by unikrunk
me too, and the Veep is away...so, hung over and stiff, the debate moves forward!

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:41 pm
by Bob Samonkey
Lady Sheridan wrote:I have seen older guys in that good of shape before, it's not completely unknown, particularly if they've got Hollywood trainers and such.


Jack Palance springs to mind. 71 doing one armed push-ups. The man had to have pecs. Shaven or no.

Image

Image

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:42 pm
by unikrunk
TheBaxter wrote:I don't see what difference a comparison between Khan Ricardo and TOS Ricardo, or even Fantasy Island Ricardo, makes... maybe he pulled a Christian Bale and bulked up especially for the role. Compare Machinist Christian Bale to Batman Christian Bale, less than a year later.


The guy was 70. Bale is what, 32? Gaining and losing that much muscle mass at his age would have killed him. The man is no Jack LaLanne

/and that’s the beauty of my juice weasel plan!

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:44 pm
by TheBaxter
Bob Poopflingius Maximus wrote:
Lady Sheridan wrote:I have seen older guys in that good of shape before, it's not completely unknown, particularly if they've got Hollywood trainers and such.


Jack Palance springs to mind. 71 doing one armed push-ups. The man had to have pecs. Shaven or no.

Image

Image


c'mon, EVERYONE knows palance waxes... and not just his chest.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:45 pm
by unikrunk
Bob Poopflingius Maximus wrote:
Lady Sheridan wrote:I have seen older guys in that good of shape before, it's not completely unknown, particularly if they've got Hollywood trainers and such.


Jack Palance springs to mind. 71 doing one armed push-ups. The man had to have pecs. Shaven or no.

Image

Image


That's not physical strength; it's bat-shit crazy. The man was suffering through dementia, and was obviously fucking insane. Also, doing a couple one handed push ups in not the same as being Ahhnuld ripped.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:47 pm
by TheBaxter
unikrunk wrote:
TheBaxter wrote:I don't see what difference a comparison between Khan Ricardo and TOS Ricardo, or even Fantasy Island Ricardo, makes... maybe he pulled a Christian Bale and bulked up especially for the role. Compare Machinist Christian Bale to Batman Christian Bale, less than a year later.


The guy was 70. Bale is what, 32? Gaining and losing that much muscle mass at his age would have killed him. The man is no Jack LaLanne


He didn't have to go from like, 100 lbs to 180 lbs though. i'm sure 6 months in the gym and the right diet, he could get some pecs, especially if he was already in good shape...

and if not, he could've used steroids.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:52 pm
by Bob Samonkey
unikrunk wrote:
Bob Poopflingius Maximus wrote:
Lady Sheridan wrote:I have seen older guys in that good of shape before, it's not completely unknown, particularly if they've got Hollywood trainers and such.


Jack Palance springs to mind. 71 doing one armed push-ups. The man had to have pecs. Shaven or no.

Image

Image


That's not physical strength; it's bat-shit crazy. The man was suffering through dementia, and was obviously fucking insane. Also, doing a couple one handed push ups in not the same as being Ahhnuld ripped.


I would have to be. I can't even do one with one hand. And I should be able to what with the extra ground coverage with my hand

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:52 pm
by unikrunk
Baxter, I can see it now, Monty tying off with Shatner's belt between takes, shooting horse 'roids.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:54 pm
by Lady Sheridan
unikrunk wrote:
WAXY300LOVEILASH

Madame, methinks 300 has given you a case of the vapors :D

I humbly disagree that the prosthetics could not be done in 1982. Also, I am stuck on the lack of muscle movement throughout the film.

/Waxy!


Oh, indeed! Pass the smelling salts, I have a weak constitution!

Actually, it's kind of an interesting concidence because there were alot of accusations that the muscles in "300," particularly those of Loincloth, were prosthetic or CGI.

I know they had prosthetic capability in 1982, but think about other make-up and prosthetics of the 70's and 80's. There's no way they could make one so good we'd be arguing about it in 2006.

It's the color that convinces me. It's REALLY hard to paint over latex and have it match your skin tone, let alone the texture. The skin is smooth, but not smooth enough for prosthetic.

I will concede that he may very well have implants.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:13 pm
by austenandrews
unikrunk wrote:The guy was 70. Bale is what, 32? Gaining and losing that much muscle mass at his age would have killed him. The man is no Jack LaLanne
\
He was 60. Here is a pic (best I could Google) of him in "How the West Was Won" just three or four years earlier. He obviously kept in excellent shape.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:14 pm
by unikrunk
which one is he?

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:17 pm
by austenandrews
The one who isn't James Arness or a woman.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:18 pm
by unikrunk
>explosive evil laughter<

I think I just scared the dick out of my employees.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:38 pm
by DennisMM
I always thought Montalban was in shape until I heard the prosthetic chest rumor. I thought a prosthetic unlikely because of the uniformity of chest, arms and neck. Enough people told the prosthetic chest story that I began to believe it.

Nicholas Meyer's statement that Montalban's chest was natural is good enough for me. Meyer is pretty up-front about everything else having to do with TROK, especially his loathing of Shatner, so I'm willing to believe him.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:56 pm
by austenandrews
unikrunk wrote:>explosive evil laughter<

I think I just scared the dick out of my employees.

So... is that derision or avoidance? ;)

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 1:57 pm
by unikrunk
austenandrews wrote:
unikrunk wrote:>expl osive evil laughter<

I think I just scared the dick out of my employees.

So... is that derision or avoidance? ;)


neither, I still think they are implants or prosthetic (in TWOK). And he is still wearing a rug in every picture posted so far.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 2:57 pm
by TheBaxter
unikrunk wrote:Baxter, I can see it now, Monty tying off with Shatner's belt between takes, shooting horse 'roids.


actually, the more i think about it the more this makes sense... after all, it would explain a lot of other things about his performance in that movie.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 3:00 pm
by unikrunk
Well, I am somewhat recanting, folks. After extensive googling, reading excerpts from Nimoy's "I am not Spock", and the photgraghpic evidence presented by austenandrews, I can no longer stand behind my prosthetics claim. The chest is not a prosthetic.

/I still think they are implants.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 3:01 pm
by unikrunk
TheBaxter wrote:
unikrunk wrote:Baxter, I can see it now, Monty tying off with Shatner's belt between takes, shooting horse 'roids.


actually, the more i think about it the more this makes sense... after all, it would explain a lot of other things about his performance in that movie.


Yes, but replace the 'roids with coke or meth, and I think we have something. Look at his freaking eyes! The man is geeked on blow, says I.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 4:27 pm
by Adam Balm
unikrunk wrote:
TheBaxter wrote:
unikrunk wrote:Baxter, I can see it now, Monty tying off with Shatner's belt between takes, shooting horse 'roids.


actually, the more i think about it the more this makes sense... after all, it would explain a lot of other things about his performance in that movie.


Yes, but replace the 'roids with coke or meth, and I think we have something. Look at his freaking eyes! The man is geeked on blow, says I.


I think he's high on himself. Like Begbie in Trainspotting.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 4:44 pm
by TheBaxter
or he's high on corinthian leather. i hear corinthian-leather-sniffing is getting to be a bigger and bigger problem these days.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 7:19 pm
by austenandrews
unikrunk wrote:Well, I am somewhat recanting, folks. After extensive googling, reading excerpts from Nimoy's "I am not Spock", and the photgraghpic evidence presented by austenandrews, I can no longer stand behind my prosthetics claim. The chest is not a prosthetic.

/I still think they are implants.

I don't see the need, but they could be implants. Did they do pec implants back then?