Kubrickian Classics

Which director made the best films, made the best visuals, or smelled the best? This is the forum to find out.

Kubrick, take your pick...

2001
17
23%
Barry Lyndon
5
7%
A Clockwork Orange
12
16%
Dr. Strangelove
18
24%
Full Metal Jacket
5
7%
The Killing
1
1%
Lolita
2
3%
Paths of Glory
0
No votes
The Shining
11
15%
Eyes Wide Shut
4
5%
 
Total votes : 75

Postby Octaveaeon on Tue Aug 16, 2005 5:19 pm

ok Harry, enough with the word changes... dammit!

F ather= studly? Why?
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Postby Keepcoolbutcare on Tue Aug 16, 2005 5:21 pm

anything with F A T turns into studly.

type in the lead of the Killer name and see what you get.
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Postby Octaveaeon on Tue Aug 16, 2005 5:29 pm

I don't get it... what Killer..?
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Postby Adam Balm on Tue Aug 16, 2005 5:30 pm

God, I think my eyes are bleeding after reading Octogenarian's latest.

Ock, two tips

1) Summarize instead of copying.

2) I think you're trying a little too hard to sound deep and profound there, bud.
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Postby John-Locke on Tue Aug 16, 2005 5:33 pm

Chow Yun-Fat

Yeah I didn't even attempt to read all that, the main TB's need spacers to avoid hurting my eyes.
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Postby TonyWilson on Tue Aug 16, 2005 5:34 pm

A previous post I made about AI's end.

AI, I happen to think the film paints itself into a corner in the first 2 parts. When he finally gets to the blue fairy the film doesn't have anywhere left to go. Having said that what comes after does fit in perfectly with the logic and truth of the story

It's a bit jarring at first but I find it terribly terribly sad. Yet he does find a certain happiness with his mother. It's both transient and infinite. You couldn't end that film in any other way that wouldn't ruin its integrity.
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Postby St. Alphonzo on Tue Aug 16, 2005 5:35 pm

Strangelove is the perfect satire to me. There was a time when A Clockwork Orange would have taken the top spot, but Strangelove gets more and more perfect every time I see it.


I kinda wish I hadn't seen "The Life and Death of Peter Sellers", 'cause now I look at Sellers in a completely different way (and not in a good way).
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Postby Octaveaeon on Tue Aug 16, 2005 5:37 pm

anyways...

yeah, all the movies tying up together chronologically... interesting... looks like I'll have to take a day off to find out!

Now, concerning the other article... I don't really believe that the guy was offed, though I'll leave the matter open, just for exposing any occult secrets, simply because these 'secrets' were pretty much out in the open already.

Hence the title... Eyes WIDE shut... the shit is before us already, yet we somehow choose to ignore it, and instead let our imaginations take control... not to mention our material needs and our lusts...

That's why in the end of EWS, the final decision is to FUCK.

Not to LOVE.

And Love, is what AI is all about... Love, as the final goal, and the emotions, and divine consciousness, that Love is capale of awakening through the process...

In 2001, HAL predates this notion, that machines can acquire a 'humanity' that humans, like David and Frank, and those in AI, had lost, or forgotten about...
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Postby Adam Balm on Tue Aug 16, 2005 5:39 pm

See, that wasn't that hard. Good points made, Ock, even without reposting whole paragraphs.
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Postby Octaveaeon on Tue Aug 16, 2005 5:45 pm

I fixed the above post too... you're right about it hurting the eyes (ouch!)

Still, I feel i made some valid points, and I added another example from EWS... please, give it another try...
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Postby Octaveaeon on Tue Aug 16, 2005 5:54 pm

Actually, I think the first 2 parts are crucial to understanding the conversation that David has at the end with one of the super-Mechas.

Take notice:

As soon as he is abandoned by his mother, and gets lost among the other forgotten robots, a huge MOON 'rises' in the sky....

...and in the end, while he is talking to the super-Mecha, there is a full MOON that sets at the end of the conversation....

THERE is your link to to Thoth, aka Hermes...
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Postby John-Locke on Tue Aug 16, 2005 5:55 pm

I got halfway through and developed a headache, I'll finish it later.

At the end of the day it's only a movie ;-)
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Postby Octaveaeon on Tue Aug 16, 2005 5:59 pm

John-Locke wrote:At the end of the day it's only a movie ;-)


Ofcourse, you're entitled to your views...

But Kubrick would certainly have disagreed, otherewise he wouldn't have devoted the amount of time to each of his projects in the way he did...

And if that were the case, we wouldn't have had the priviledge of watching the masterpieces that he has bequethed us.

After all, is the Sistine chapel just a painting? Are the pyramids just some buildings?

Just sayin', that's all... :roll:
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Postby John-Locke on Tue Aug 16, 2005 6:00 pm

I was making a joke, movies are my life.
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Postby bluebottle on Tue Aug 16, 2005 6:01 pm

Octaveaeon wrote:After all, is the Sistine chapel just a painting? Are the pyramids just some buildings?


They're works of art, for sure.

But at the end of the day...
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Postby Octaveaeon on Tue Aug 16, 2005 6:13 pm

Really, don't get me wrong, I don't want to play the preacher man and all... I just want to be clear that even at the end of the day, art, at least art of this caliber, is more than just entertainment, at least for those who make it, and for many who have developed a strong connection with what those works portray...

Ask anybody who is deeply involved, like a museum curator, or any artist or art historian, about the 'importance of art'...

This is one of the main reasons why Hollywood churns out the crap that it does, at least the majority. If you guys don't understand this, then you'll just continue complaining about 'the system' ad infinitum... without any change ever taking place...

and remember... in AI the earth has been heavily transformed by the effects of climatological changes...

at the end of the day, that is what Kubrick wanted us to understand... and with EWS, he was attempting to get us to do something...

not just sit behind computers talking about the next hollywood blockbuster...

sorry, slight criticism... but really people... are your eyes still Wide Shut?

it's not like we have the time...

[ehh, still friends?]
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Postby Octaveaeon on Tue Aug 16, 2005 6:16 pm

if you notice, i live in amsterdam, which in the beginning of AI, along with NY and Venice, are the places that first get inundated (along with all coastal areas)...

so consider this a cry for help

HELP! I live under the sea level!
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Postby John-Locke on Tue Aug 16, 2005 6:23 pm

No seriously Doc Ock I completely agree, that's why Kubrick is the best, his films are not just entertainment but also great works of Art with important significance for their place in the world, but the human soul also needs pure entertainment, without the deeper meanings and religious parallels. That’s why I like to talk about Kubrick, Lynch, Jodorowsky and Kitano as much as I like talking about Spielberg, Cheech & Chong, Monty Python and Quentin Tarantino. You cant take everything too seriously all of the time or you will end up with a Brain aneurism and an early grave.
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Postby bluebottle on Tue Aug 16, 2005 6:26 pm

i would never argue against the importance of art, or it's place in educating/informing the public.

After a two hour film, people are much more likely to think and discuss what they saw.

And I've never read a pamphlet, called up a buddy and said, "hey, you should read this... did you know we are running out of fuel?!"

I don't think anyone's arguing any of this.

Are you suggesting that a filmmaker like Kubrick was in it ONLY for the art? Only made movies to express his ideas?

This, I think, is a fascinating topic for debate, and it's been touched upon in earlier threads.

Personally, I have a hard time believing that there wasn't a part of Kubrick's brain that wasn't in it for the money, the fame, the girls...

I dunno.

I really liked 2001.
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Postby TonyWilson on Tue Aug 16, 2005 6:40 pm

I think Kubrick was an artist first, certainly his early work and obseesion with photography shows this.
But I'm also sure there was a side of him that was seduced with the "movie" business although probably not for long.
Having said that he still had an eye on making accessible films that anyone can enjoy, obviously the more you know about art, myth and movies the more you will find to enjoy.

Octavaeon I wouldn't accuse anyone of having there eyes wide shut, not in the PZ anyway, save that for the fuckknuckles in the TB's
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Postby Octaveaeon on Tue Aug 16, 2005 6:54 pm

Totally agree... and I too have many a silly indulgence to keep me level, trust you me...

but dammit this is a Kubrick thread! YOu know, the guy with the lack of emotion and humor (or so they said)! Even with Dr. Strangelove he was talking about nuclear holocaust... and it turned out to be one of the most poignant movies on the subject... and it has a cowboy riding a goddamn bomb! Yeeeehaaaaa!

As far as his other motives, well, I think we should judge people by their actions... in this case his filmic legacy. Still, I firmly believe that no one is perfect... but we can at least try to do 'good'...

But yeah, he did his thing, and I guess I'll just do mine. I won't trouble you guys with that though... for now, it's time for me to say adiós... I'm really tired...I'm not sleeping well lately...

...maybe in the future we'll come across again. I hope so. I have some very good and plausible ideas (political, philosophical) that I want to develop further, and particularly an idea for a screenplay that you guys would probably have really digged, and I think it would have made Kubrick proud, but it would take too much time to explain... more than what I've layed out already on AI, EWS, etc... (and there was more I wanted to get into...)

Alas, I see that the time is not yet ripe for me to open up. Hopefully within a year, who knows... maybe I'll be better at it... you know, funnier, more interesting.. who knows the techniques I still need to master... (patience!)...I'm taking a year off from university to dedicate myself to these things...

Please, tell Harry or Doc or whoever to not discard my name from the memberlist, even if I don't show up in all this time.

...

I'm a firm believer in the "If you want it done right, then do it yourself" school of philosophy...

It was nice talking to you guys, really. It would have been nice to have had these chats in person though... I'da bought the first round!

Take care!

K.

P.S. I hope you are right Tony. You all seem like upstanding folks, for sure, but I know many people, including friends and family, whom, despite all their assertions to the contrary, still have their "eyes wide shut". In the end, this is something that only one, personally, can judge, so I am indeed wrong for having made this generalization. For that I apologize. My only advice is: seek out what having one's "eyes wide open" really entails... Trust me, it is more than just 'knowing' a few things, like what Kubrick was all about. In the end, this has nothing to do with him...
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Postby John-Locke on Tue Aug 16, 2005 6:58 pm

Seriously you are leaving the Zone for a year?

WTF dude, stay around, don't do anything drastic, you just got here.
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Postby TonyWilson on Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:00 pm

Oh man, Octavaeon we didnt want you to do that.
Hell we like a deep conversation about films as much as anyone, we just have a laugh as a way of puncturing the prententiousness people find themselves in sometimes.

As for having eyes wide open, well buddy I'm an enlightened soul, as pretentious as that may well sound. It's true.
Comeback Octa, we like you.
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Postby Brocktune on Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:34 pm

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Postby St. Alphonzo on Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:41 pm

Quite a resemblance!
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Postby bluebottle on Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:42 pm

is that your way of saying goodbye Brocktune?

Jeez, all the n00bs are dropping like flies.

What did I say?!
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Postby DinoDeLaurentiis on Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:52 pm

Do you think a I sent him over a the edge?
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Postby bluebottle on Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:55 pm

It's all your fault you cagey old freakshow!
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Postby Brocktune on Tue Aug 16, 2005 7:58 pm

hell no. thats my way of saying that Stanley Kubrick is greater than fuckin GOD man! im not dropping until every single thread is over my head. poetry not intended.
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Postby Brocktune on Tue Aug 16, 2005 8:00 pm

actually, you guys are surprisingly hospitable. a lot of boards i have posted on or tried to post on, well, lets just say there a a lot of dicks out there, and none of them have enough going for them to justify their dickishness. Thanks for not eating me alive!
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Postby burlivesleftnut on Tue Aug 16, 2005 8:00 pm

HAHA I totally missed the LESS THAN symbol.
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Postby Brocktune on Tue Aug 16, 2005 8:05 pm

you got the night vision like the wise old owl
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Postby DinoDeLaurentiis on Tue Aug 16, 2005 9:25 pm

Wouldn't it a be funny iffa Octaveeaoaen was a just a Nimpy v2.0? Like, he's a thinking "ok, I got it this a time..." anna then he's alla "sonofa..."
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Postby bluebottle on Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:02 pm

the day that the name, "Nimpy" stops making me laugh so god damned hard is the day i bid adieu to this stupid planet.
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Postby John-Locke on Sat Dec 10, 2005 10:49 am

Bump
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Postby ZombieZoneSolutions on Sat Dec 10, 2005 10:58 am

i voted Lolita because it's also my favorite novel. although, i love ALL of Kubricks films more or less equallty. his work is flawless...

how come you didn't put Eyes Wide Shut on the poll? it's also a masterpiece...
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Postby thomasgaffney on Sat Dec 10, 2005 11:01 am

I can't speak for KCBC, but he night have tried. There were problems with polls in the beginning when we didn't know that we had to add a blank option as the last choice or else it cut our bottom choice off.

There were quite a few polls where the bottom option was cut off until we figured this out.
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Postby thomasgaffney on Sat Dec 10, 2005 11:04 am

keepcoolbutcare wrote:
Octaveaeon wrote:
Ehhh, wait a minute, where's Eyes Wide Shut?!


Intentionally left out for two reasons.

1. The studio rape job of the party scene.

2. I don't think that this is the movie Kubrick would have put out. I know it was "completed" (suspiciously, I might add) right before his death, but c'mon!

oh wait, three reasons...it sucked.


I stand corrected. It was left off on purpose to reasons listed above.
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Postby John-Locke on Sat Dec 10, 2005 11:09 am

Well it's on now.

And in honour of our favourite Director, The Master that is Stanley Kubrick, I hope no other mods make a mockery of the poll by adding King Kong, I will not stand for such belligerent tomfoolery in this shrine to our Cinematic God.
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Postby Gentleman on Sat Dec 10, 2005 11:16 am

Too bad i caught this too late.

Even though my signature may suggest something else, I'd have to say my favorite Kubrick film is 2001. Sometimes I don't even consider it as a film, but as something else, something that goes beyond such definition. A profound work of art that gets to your soul in unexplainable ways. With its very limited dialogue. Kubrick was indeed always concerned about the human conflict... about what made us what we are... and in 2001, his timeless epic, he approaches this issue in a different way as he would later. In 2001, a very subtle film in a way, a very dull film to some, I think, again, that he approaches this in a more profound way and I believe HAL to be a very important piece of the puzzle. BUT talking in more straight ways, you just have to love the beginning and the end of this film. A remarkable achievement in the history of cinema... or better yet, in the history of art, if you will.

But all of his films are masterpieces. Of course, there is always more talk about Dr. Strangelove, Shining, FMJ, Clockwork, 2001 and Barry Lyndon than there is about The Killing, Paths, Spartacus, Lolita and Eyes Wide Shut... but that doesn't make the latter less Kubrick. And for the record, there's something about EWS. I can't explain what it is... but there is something about it. Meditate on this, i will (and have been).

And I guess I'm in the same league as the first poster, for Gilliam is also my other favorite.
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Postby Alex DeLarge on Sat Dec 10, 2005 11:29 am

I obviously voted for Clockwork Orange, one of my all time favorite movies. Ive also seen and loved FMJ, The Shining, Spartacus, and i didnt like 2001 at all. I feel ashamed to say this but i havent actually seen Dr. Strangelove, which is supposedly his best, ill rent it pretty soon.
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Postby ZombieZoneSolutions on Sat Dec 10, 2005 11:32 am

John-Locke wrote:Well it's on now.

And in honour of our favourite Director, The Master that is Stanley Kubrick, I hope no other mods make a mockery of the poll by adding King Kong, I will not stand for such belligerent tomfoolery in this shrine to our Cinematic God.


i agree 100%!

btw, Eyes Wide Shut is, without a doubt, the most underrated, underappreciated and widely misunderstood film ever made. it is also, without a doubt, the most honest film EVER made about marriage and intimate relationships in general. i think people didn't like it because it made them feel uncomfortable about their relationships -- which are, more often than not, based on a series of lies and deceptions, from the tiny to the huge.

everyone lies to the one they love. and nobody really wants their significant other to be really honest with them. because, if you were really honest you would have to admit that, "hell yeah, i wanna fuck other people!" likewise, you probably don't want to hear that your girlfriend feels the same way... (a revelation that just about blows Cruise's very deluded and naive mind. the scene in the bedroom where they are having the argument is one of my favorite in the history of cinema.)

also, that the whole institution of marriage is a sham. the only reason people don't "cheat" is out of fear of reprisal from the spouse, NOT because they don't desire other people.

in alot of ways, Eyes Wide Shut is one of Kubricks darkest films. its also one of his most hilarious. and not only because he takes great pains to shoot Cruise so that we can all see how short he actually is (pretty much all of the other actors tower over him), but because his character is such a contemptable nimrod. in addition, the fact that it lends credence to the theory that he is a raging closeted homosexual. what he really is disinterested in his beautiful female patients? perhaps... if he likes boys! i love the scene where the bellboy is looking him over and flirting with him. with but a glance he says what everyone in the world already knows... Tom Cruise is very, very g@y.

now i wish i could change my vote; if only to show my support for the film...
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Postby John-Locke on Sat Dec 10, 2005 11:40 am

I cant wait until Christmas Day when I get to open my Kubrick Archives and find out some of the secrets (and get a Frame of Celluloid from his personal print of 2001), EWS is trully underated because Media Exposure gave people expectations that were simply untrue, everyone was expecting a steamy shagfest & we got a dark look at relationships and the notion of Power & Control. It definately gets better with time for some reason.
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Postby ZombieZoneSolutions on Sat Dec 10, 2005 11:44 am

Oh man, you lucky bastid!!!

That's right, isn't there a Kubrick museum opening in London? Another reason why I should have been born in Britland!!!
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Postby ThisIsTheGirl on Sat Dec 10, 2005 11:48 am

I see EWS shut as being a movie about the weirdness of male sexuality (which nicely ties it in with Lolita, if you like your Kubrick tie-ins).

I think it's one of his very best. I've loved Paths of Glory for a lot longer, but I voted EWS, because I really do think it's massively underrated.
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Postby magicmonkey on Sat Dec 10, 2005 2:33 pm

Kubrick is one of those filmmakers whose films I could easily watch on loop. There is so much there for the viewer, so much open to interpretation and left ambiguious. His locations are superb. Spacially, blocked, lit and shot. I don't know why, maybe its the 4:3 ratio he shoots in or his set designers eye for contempory details which really capture an environment, a time and a place.

I voted for "A Clockwork Orange", it seems to encompass so much of all his work. Its his Fanny and Alexander. An accumalation of all he has to say.

I love the use of his voiceovers, its a great device, whether it guides you in interpretation or whether it provides another perspective, it works a treat. Carrying you down and through the narrative.

I could wax on lyrically about this guy for a long long time. Damn it, he's dead.
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Postby Shane on Sat Dec 10, 2005 3:43 pm

I liked the re-make of Lolita more than Kubricks original.
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Postby Keepcoolbutcare on Sat Dec 10, 2005 3:58 pm

Shane wrote:I liked the re-make of Lolita more than Kubricks original.


Well, Kubrick and Nabokov (who has screenplay credits) knew that they couldn't get away with all that much.

Plus, c'mon man, his had Peter Sellers!
Personally, I'm an atheist in the voting booth and a theist in the movie theatre. I separate the morality of religion with the spirituality and solace of it. There is something boring about atheism.
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Postby ZombieZoneSolutions on Sat Dec 10, 2005 4:27 pm

I thought the remake was okay, but I think it missed the point of the novel. For instance, the remake was very somber; whoever wrote the script completely missed the absurdist dark humor of the novel...

Of course, child molestation is not funny, but Nabokov made it funny by examing how ridiculous Humbert Humbert ultimately is/was. He's a nimrod with a huge intellectual ego at the mercy of his twisted desires and a sexually precocious nymphette...

Plus, hey, you know, when the author of the novel co-writes the script with the director and the driector is Kubrick? Which do you think it closer to the original vision?

Of course, Sue Lyon was about 17 or 18 at the time whereas in the novel Lolita is supposed to be 13, 14. For the remake they were able to cast a younger girl.

Oh, btw, there is not one graphic sex scene in the novel, but it seems like it, which makes it brilliant. At most everything is implied through symbols and poetic langauge...
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Postby smatterkitty on Sat Dec 10, 2005 4:56 pm

That's what I love about Lolita, you feel dirty for reading even there is no graphic sex in the novel.

I think what makes you feel so dirty is that at some points (especially the end) you symapthize with Humbert. Despite the fact that I'm pretty sure Nabakov was a conceeded Struggling Background Artist with an ego the size of Russia, it's hard not to admire his writing.

As far as Kubrick, I have to go with Dr. Strangelove. It maybe the most brillant (and funny) movie ever made. Peter Sellers, George C. Scott an incredible young James Earl Jones and "our precious bodily fluids" may never be replicated again (but does any other administration deseve a more scathing satire than the Bush Administration?)

Although I bite my tongue when I talk about he movie out of a desperate fear that Hollywood one day may decided to remake the movie.

I could just see them turning it into an action thriller staring Vin Diesel, Brad Pitt and turning Dr. Strangelove into a woman so Angelina Jolie could have a part.
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