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THE FILMS OF QUENTIN TARANTINO

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 6:56 pm
by WinslowLeach
A former video store clerk turned screenwriter/director who has become a legend to film geeks all over the world. Heres the place to discuss the electrifying pop culture films (written and directed) of Quentin Tarantino.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:09 pm
by MasterWhedon
I think Pulp Fiction is a better film, but I love Reservoir Dogs. I like the theatricality of it, the simplicity.

Jackie Brown is also great, though I prefer Out of Sight when it comes to Leonard adaptations.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:13 pm
by John-Locke
I went for True Romance although I think all of the others are better films, Reservoir Dogs being my favourite. I must have seen True Romance more times than all of the others combined, and thats a lot. QT's dialogue, some supurb cameos, a great story, music ripped off from "Badlands", it all adds up IMHO to be the most re-watchable of the films he was involved in, but not the best. Does that make sense?

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:14 pm
by lyra belacqua
I really like them all, but Kill Bill was just epic and fun enough to push it past the classy Jackie Brown. While True Romance and Resevoir Dogs have funny lines, great acting, and film geek scenerios, they fail a bit for me as a whole movie. Pulp Fiction is just classic, but I'm not a Travolta fan.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:29 pm
by WinslowLeach
I think True Romance may be QTs best script. I love Dogs and Pulp, but TR has so many great monologues and references. It was the first time I had listened to a films dialogue and been excited about how cool it was.

I think in terms of pure cinema, Kill Bill is his best film so far. Dogs is a great smaller cult/debut film, Pulp is his "classiest" film in terms of not being overly exploitive and more dialogue based. Jackie Brown is an excellent adaptation film, great characters and dialogue. To me it seemed like a film by a veteran director, it just flows so smoothly.

The music in every QT film is perfect.

That being said I love them all for different reasons. I just hope to see more films before he retires.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:31 pm
by John-Locke
Has anybody other than me got the Jap version of Kill Bill Vol 1? it just seems so much more violent when It doesn't go B&W, I'm sure there are loads of extra bits in the House of blue leaves but I can only be sure of one instance for sure (the extra bit with the Kid, way before "Now Go home to your Mother") and one thing that bothers me is you get to see Sophie's other arm getting chopped off in the Trunk but when the bride kicks her down the hill towards the hospital you can see she still has one arm, nitpicky I know, but those things bother me.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:38 pm
by MasterWhedon
I've only seen True Romance once, and it was years after all the hoopla. Maybe it's me, but I thought it worked as a series of strung-together scenes. As a movie, I thought it was a bit muddled.

And I agree about Quentin's music. The "Stuck in a Moment with You" scene in Dogs is friggin fantastic.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:40 pm
by WinslowLeach
See reply below...

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:41 pm
by WinslowLeach
John-Locke wrote:Has anybody other than me got the Jap version of Kill Bill Vol 1? it just seems so much more violent when It doesn't go B&W, I'm sure there are loads of extra bits in the House of blue leaves but I can only be sure of one instance for sure (the extra bit with the Kid, way before "Now Go home to your Mother") and one thing that bothers me is you get to see Sophie's other arm getting chopped off in the Trunk but when the bride kicks her down the hill towards the hospital you can see she still has one arm, nitpicky I know, but those things bother me.


Well it IS an Exploitation film after all, its supposed to be gory as hell. I have the R2 Japanese version too and its the one I like most. I really hated the whole B&W HOBL sequence in the US version. It ruined the pure Grindhouse feel of the film for me.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:44 pm
by wonkabar
I agree, True Romance is absolutely his best script. Better dialogue, better plot. It's seems to be the most realistic somehow. Like it doesn't have funny lines just for the sake of having them. You really buy all the characters. Plus I think Tony Scott (although he's made some dumb movies) is a far more experienced action director. And Scott's ending was proof that not all writers know what plays best on the screen. I've always felt TR wasn't given enough credit

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:44 pm
by John-Locke
I apologise before hand for my being pedantic but Japanese DVD's are Region 2 the same as the UK.

Did you notice any other extra bits? I'm sure there are a couple of extra shots of Limb carnage in HOBL, on top of the extra Anime disembowelment of the Pedo Yakuza Boss.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:47 pm
by WinslowLeach
MasterWhedon wrote:I've only seen True Romance once, and it was years after all the hoopla. Maybe it's me, but I thought it worked as a series of strung-together scenes. As a movie, I thought it was a bit muddled.


Are you sure it was True Romance you were watching? I think this is the best non-directed QT scripted film there is.

Another thing that makes it so cool, is that Clarence Worley (Christian Slater) is QTs movie alter ego in the film which makes it a special gem.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:50 pm
by John-Locke
Does anybody remember the Trailer for True Romance that showed Walken in the hallway outside the Hotel Room, It's not in the Directors cut I own, another came out 8 months later, my friend who owns it says it doesn't show up there either. Anybody have any info?

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:50 pm
by WinslowLeach
John-Locke wrote:I apologise before hand for my being pedantic but Japanese DVD's are Region 2 the same as the UK.

Did you notice any other extra bits? I'm sure there are a couple of extra shots of Limb carnage in HOBL, on top of the extra Anime disembowelment of the Pedo Yakuza Boss.


The only parts I really remember (havent watched this in months) is the parts with Sofie and the Yakuza boss. I think some of the shots are extended a little in different scenes too.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:53 pm
by MasterWhedon
WinslowLeach wrote:Are you sure it was True Romance you were watching? I think this is the best non-directed QT scripted film there is.


Yup, very surely. My friend made a big deal out of the fact that I was finally seeing it. I don't know, just didn't do it for me.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:53 pm
by WinslowLeach
John-Locke wrote:Does anybody remember the Trailer for True Romance that showed Walken in the hallway outside the Hotel Room, It's not in the Directors cut I own, another came out 8 months later, my friend who owns it says it doesn't show up there either. Anybody have any info?


I never saw Walken outside the hotel room in the Directors Cut either. Theres only a few slight differences, one of extended Alabama kicking James Gandolfini's ass, and a little bit more time spent during the climax of the big shootout in Lee's hotel suite.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:58 pm
by Agent Alonzo
Has to be Pulp... It really shook up the whole world of cinema when it was released, and created a spark of imitators.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:58 pm
by John-Locke
The version my buddy owns apparently has Clarence Dying at the end, Gandolfini getting medieval and Alabama kicking ass is all in my version.

another thing I've noticed (but could be well off on) is that in Dogs when Kietel and Tierney are chatting in his office, Mr White mentions working with a girl named Alabama, maybe I heard it wrong, It's a nice thought though.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 7:58 pm
by Agent Alonzo
I don't know why I wrote 'spark of imitators', that makes no sense... Try host instead...

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:00 pm
by WinslowLeach
JL: On my Directors Cut Clarence doesnt die. Its basically the same as the theatrical cut exept for the 2 things I mentioned.

The reason Alabama is mentioned in Dogs is because it takes place after Clarence dies (as in the original QT script) The story goes that Bama went off to work with Larry/Mr White. In the film version Tony Scott had Clarence live instead. The old Hollywood happy ending won.

I also noticed something fun: In the end of True Romance Clarence gets blood in his eye and he gets an eyepatch...

In Dogs Mr Brown gets shot and gets blood in HIS eye.

In Kill Bill, Elle Driver wears a patch on her eye. :)

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:06 pm
by wonkabar
You also see Val Kilmer's face in in the trailer/TV spots. But nothing in the deleted scenes. I always thought it was so funny how they advertised the shit out his "appearance" in the film even on the new box. Yet the DC-DVD doesn't mention Gandolfini or Sam Jackson who both have WAY bigger parts. Funny how those guys are huge now and Slater....what was the name of that horror flick that just came out on video? Poor guy, he was great in TR.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:12 pm
by John-Locke
WinslowLeach wrote
I also noticed something fun: In the end of True Romance Clarence gets blood in his eye and he gets an eyepatch...

In Dogs Mr Brown gets shot and gets blood in HIS eye.

In Kill Bill, Elle Driver wears a patch on her eye.


Does that explain your avatar then? Also I noticed Sinister Spanky had an Eye patch in the Kentucky Fried Movie Poster you made, was that you by any chance?

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:16 pm
by WinslowLeach
Well my avatar is actually inspired by 2 movies: Phantom of the Paradise (where my nick is from) and Kill Bill (the Bride doing the Eagles Claw eye snatch)

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:23 pm
by John-Locke
I've never seen Phantom of the Paradise, But I don't usually like Musicals, "South Park, Bigger Longer and Uncut" being my favourite, followed closely by "Cry Baby", do you think I might like it?

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:30 pm
by WinslowLeach
Well its not a "musical" in the traditional sense. Its more of a film that has music numbers being performed in it. Like, its not a film where people break into song out of the blue like Rocky Horror etc. Its one of my favorite cult films, so Id reccomend it to you. Let me know what you think when you see it.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:33 pm
by John-Locke
I'll check it out when I have the cash, thanks WL.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 9:50 pm
by Cbabbitt
It's close between Kill Bill and Jackie Brown. KB is just an explosion of cinematic technique, and it's thrilling. Jackie Brown has my favorite QT dialogue though. Not to mention it gets better and better on subsequent viewing. Very close.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 9:52 pm
by Cbabbitt
BTW, Kill Bill Vol. 1, as half a film, is better than his first two films. It's that good, IMO.

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 10:57 pm
by thomasgaffney
I voted for Pulp Fiction. I can watch that movie every day for ever. My favorite out of them all. But if I had to vote for which movie I think is better (Better made, etc), than I would vote for Reservoir Dogs. That movie just crackles with energy and inspired performances by actors that really got behind the director's vision

PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2005 11:34 pm
by Adam Balm
Why isn't Natural Born Killers an option?

PostPosted: Sat Aug 06, 2005 9:15 am
by WinslowLeach
NBK isnt a QT film, its an Oliver Stone film based on the story by QT.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 8:58 am
by DinoDeLaurentiis
It's a gotta be True Romance for a the Dino, iffa only for the size of a the balls onna the Dennis Hopper for a telling that story about a the "Italian History" right a before Walken puts one inna his a head, eh?

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 9:21 am
by WinslowLeach
Cliff: "...cuz YOU are part eggplant"

Coccotti: "You're a cantelope HAHAHAHA!!"

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 10:06 am
by banthafodderUK
In the Kill Bill DVD special features trailer section, there's a 'bootleg' trailer - in this, there are a couple of shots of a black man wielding a sword..... Is this scene cut from the film?

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 10:39 am
by John-Locke
Bathafodder, it's a deleted scene from Kill Bill Volume 2, Bill Fights Damoe played by Micheal Jai White (the dude who played Spawn) in a hilariously cool scene where he talks with a english accent similar to the dubbed Kung-Fu films of the early 80', he keeps on saying "You Bastard", its funny stuff. Get the DVD if you haven't already.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 10:45 am
by banthafodderUK
IS IT A SPECIAL EDITION OR FOREIGN VERSION JOHN?

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 11:01 am
by John-Locke
Normal Region 2 .

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 11:19 am
by WinslowLeach
I love that little scene. Its cool that Michael Jai White is doing that kung fu style Kiwi accent without the actual overdub.

"You bastard!"

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 11:40 am
by ThisIsTheGirl
Reservoir Dogs is my favourite, without a doubt.

Alonzo is right to point out that Pulp shook up the world of cinema, but Reservoir Dogs did exactly the same - it's just that the buzz it created was mainly confined to people within the film industry and young British men [like me!]

But enough people recognised it as a work of genius to allow Pulp Fiction to be made in the first place. It's kind of like the difference between Nirvana's first album "Bleach" and their second "Nevermind". Almost everybody owns or recognises Nevermind, but it wouldn't have been made if enough people in the industry hadn't heard Bleach and understood why it was so important.

Also, sorry to disappear up my own arse for a moment, but Reservoir Dogs has a structure like a modern-day Greek tragedy - and you can't say that about many heist movies (including City on Fire!)

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 12:54 pm
by WinslowLeach
As much as I love Dogs, Pulp and Jackie, I'm glad that QT is doing new genres. To me, The Crazy 88 massacre (all dressed like Dogs/Vincent & Jules) in Kill Bill Vol 1 represents the end of the crime films (Dogs, Pulp, Jackie) and the beginning of a new era.

This was what I thought after thinking about it all:

Image

The Bride wearing Bruce Lees yellow tracksuit (which for Lee represented the non affiliation to any one style of martial arts) could be connected to QTs starting the new exploration of other non-crime genres.

Does that make sense?

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 1:55 pm
by MasterWhedon
WinslowLeach wrote:The Bride wearing Bruce Lees yellow tracksuit (which for Lee represented the non affiliation to any one style of martial arts) could be connected to QTs starting the new exploration of other non-crime genres.

Does that make sense?


It does, but at the same time I think it might be a bit of a stretch. I find folks often read waaaaay too much into Quentin's films, and while there sure is plenty to analyze, I think many go too far.

He's clearly one of the most intellectual filmmakers working today, but who really knows what the big QT was thinking when he put her in the track suit? Could just be that he liked it, that it was a direct homage to Bruce Lee.

I really do enjoy QT's films, but I know some people who see him the way rabid Whedonites view Joss. That make sense? After a while, it can turn your stomach.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 3:06 pm
by WinslowLeach
I'm not trying to come off as a raving QT fanatic, but alot of times you can see things in movies after you watch them a few times. I was just looking at the different visual connotations and thought that was kinda cool.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 3:16 pm
by MasterWhedon
WinslowLeach wrote:I'm not trying to come off as a raving QT fanatic, but alot of times you can see things in movies after you watch them a few times. I was just looking at the different visual connotations and thought that was kinda cool.


Yeah, no, I don't mean to pick on you or anything, Winslow, and I agree that the visual dynamic in that scene it amazing.

My complaint is when something works as metaphor/symbol/homage on one level, many folks immediately assume it has deeper meanings than it actually does. This goes for many, many filmmakers and many, many fans and critics.

Truth is, unless we get a commentary or a running analysis by the creators, we'll never know. I like that QT's films open up this kind of debate, that they allow for many interpretations, I just don't care for too much conjecture is all.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 3:18 pm
by DinoDeLaurentiis
Sometimes, the cigar, she's just a the cigar, no?

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 3:22 pm
by burlivesleftnut
OR his work is just an insanely violent and misanthopic derivation of things that came before. Hey I like a couple of the guys movies, but to call Tarantino an "intellectual" filmmaker is a wee stretch.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 3:30 pm
by MasterWhedon
burlivesleftnut wrote:OR his work is just an insanely violent and misanthopic derivation of things that came before. Hey I like a couple of the guys movies, but to call Tarantino an "intellectual" filmmaker is a wee stretch.


Wait, Burl, seriously? We can't at least give props to the king of post-modernism? Pulp Fiction shook up the world. It's taught in every film school from here to Timbuktu.

At his most basic, the 'tino is just a glorified fanboy who does nothing BUT intellectualize film. Then he turns around and shoots a bunch of the shit he loves and throws it up on screen.

I'd say QT's in the same class as someone like Harry in their love for movies (and I would put forth that Harry is something of an film "intellectual" as well).

Kill Bill may be an "empty" exploitation film, but there's loads more thought in it that anything by Rob Cohen and his ilk.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 3:37 pm
by burlivesleftnut
Yes seriously. I have been entertained by every QT film (except Jackie Brown and Pulp Fiction--I left out of boredom, no joke), but they are not that deep. Sorry. And as for study in every film school... who cares? I think that speaks more to the decline of western civilization than QT being some kind of second coming. I like his movies, but come on.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 3:43 pm
by WinslowLeach
As much as QT steals things from other movies, I dont think anyone else puts things together cinematically as beautifully as he does. I think while it may come across as throwing things up onto the screen to some, theres most definitely always some thought behind it, whether its a tribute to other films/directors or something from his personal life.

I dont really like when people overanalyze movies to find some social or political meanings, but I do like watching QTs films to see all the interesting references to other films and to his own personal ideas.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 3:44 pm
by burlivesleftnut
WinslowLeach wrote:As much as QT steals things from other movies, I dont think anyone else puts things together cinematically as beautifully as he does. I think while it may come across as throwing things up onto the screen to some, theres most definitely always some thought behind it, whether its a tribute to other films/directors or something from his personal life.

I dont really like when people overanalyze movies to find some social or political meanings, but I do like watching QTs films to see all the interesting references to other films and to his own personal ideas.


I concur.

PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2005 3:47 pm
by MasterWhedon
burlivesleftnut wrote:Yes seriously. I have been entertained by every QT film (except Jackie Brown and Pulp Fiction--I left out of boredom, no joke), but they are not that deep. Sorry. And as for study in every film school... who cares? I think that speaks more to the decline of western civilization than QT being some kind of second coming. I like his movies, but come on.


I point to the film school thing because he is touted at the premiere post-modern auteur. He's the guy who takes junk and makes it art. It's in the shallowness of it all that the depth arises. (Could that be more vague?)

Personally, I can list off twenty, thirty filmmakers I enjoy more, but I respect the guy for what he does. I think Jackie Brown is a brilliant adaptation of an Elmore Leonard novel, but I prefer Out of Sight ten times over. I liked Kill Bill a great deal, but not nearly as much as the first time I saw The Matrix.

Anyway, if he's not your thing, that's cool, but there is a reason everyone touts him as THE Quentin Tarantino.