The Great STAR WARS Discussion Thread

New movies! Old movies! B-movies! Discuss discuss discuss!!!

Postby Cpt Kirks 2pay on Thu Dec 14, 2006 7:20 am

Well in a way, the Battle did have the Clone Wars hanging in the balance with the kidnapping. Holding Palps captive could blackmail a surrender and many other things that would have the Seperatists winning from the view of everyone involved that is. But look the way I see it is this... Lucas said, 'let's make a big fark off Space Battle that everyone has been wanting.' Only he didn't make it as big as he or others wanted. Again one reason is this story. Granted the plot device of the Battle isn't as important as it is in ROTJ, but part of the flaw of it's length and action is that GL failed o write it into the film as being as important. He could have done though, as a writer you can do anything you want. But he couldn't pull it off. The end to the means of the battle wasn't great enough.

But still having said that, the story that we are left with, STILL could have been reason enough to make the battle more thrilling and longer. It's like as soon as the 2 Jedis enter into the fight they find Grievous' ship 'straight ahead' when all around them they have what looks like an eternal stretch of battlships and fighters. Again in the script, the fight goes on for longer, with Obi Wan and Anakin fighting droid fighters for longer (and also displaying greater character interplay to their relationship) before actually locating The Invisible Hand, Grievous' ship. Plus the barricade of Droid fighters or the ship's defences themselves, blocking them from getting access to the ship should have been more intense and difficult to penetrate too. Again, all I ask is 5 odd minutes. I can't even get that in life anymore!!!!
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Postby Fried Gold on Thu Dec 14, 2006 10:39 am

I know Palpatine was controlling the whole kidnapping thing, but surely someone in the Separatist fleet wondered why they didn't just hyperjump out of there. General Grievous, this master military commander, didn't think it'd be bad to stay in orbit?
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Postby Cpt Kirks 2pay on Thu Dec 14, 2006 10:41 am

My thoughts exactly.
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Postby Fried Gold on Thu Dec 14, 2006 10:49 am

It'd be like someone breaking into the Oval Office, swiping George Bush away and then just hanging around on the front lawn of the White House.
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Postby Chairman Kaga on Thu Dec 14, 2006 12:01 pm

Fried Gold wrote:It'd be like someone breaking into the Oval Office, swiping George Bush away and then just hanging around on the front lawn of the White House.

No hurry then to get him back if he was just hanging out on the lawn.
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Postby Fried Gold on Mon Apr 23, 2007 11:57 am

A good article about Simon Pegg and his views on the films.

http://www.starwars.com/community/news/rocks/news20070420.html

Very well balanced piece, considering it's on the official site.
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Postby thebostonlocksmith on Mon Apr 23, 2007 12:10 pm

"The prequels and Special Editions are probably the most-heated debate topics among Star Wars fans," Pegg says. "When I watched Star Wars in 1977, it blew my mind and I loved it unconditionally. I never once sat there in the dark thinking, 'This is good but what it really needs is a Jawa falling off a dinosaur in the background.'


LOL
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Postby Fievel on Mon Apr 23, 2007 12:15 pm

Fried Gold wrote:A good article about Simon Pegg and his views on the films.

http://www.starwars.com/community/news/rocks/news20070420.html

Very well balanced piece, considering it's on the official site.


I really agree with his points about the Prequels bringing the series closer to Earth, and that being a bad thing.
But why the hell would Lucasfilm send him a free copy of the OT DVDs? He can afford them!!!! :evil: :lol:
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Postby Fawst on Mon Apr 23, 2007 3:19 pm

Because that's what happens when you're rich. You get shit for free.
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Postby Anti-Christ on Thu Apr 26, 2007 1:39 am

Fawst wrote:Because that's what happens when you're rich. You get shit for free.


And when you have influence individuals hope to manipulate it.
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Postby silentbobafett on Thu Apr 26, 2007 3:05 am

i do... :-)
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Postby wonkabar on Wed May 16, 2007 1:47 am

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Postby colonel_lugz on Fri May 25, 2007 12:25 pm

Good piece from Merrick up on the Mother Site

http://www.aintitcool.com/node/32797

Happy Birthday Star Wars
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Postby Nordling on Fri May 25, 2007 12:30 pm

Happy birthday, indeed. I will always be glad of STAR WARS and the impact it had on my young life.

BUT...

I am thoroughly burned out now. As the saying goes, "How can we miss you if you don't go away?" STAR WARS has permeated the culture so completely since 1997's re-release that I pretty much cringe whenever I see SW stuff now. Except for the funny Internet stuff, I pretty much avoid it. I'm not sure if I'll watch the TV show. I'm not saying I'm done with SW, but... yeah. I think I might be done with SW.
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Postby Fievel on Fri May 25, 2007 12:34 pm

I"m definitely not done with Star Wars. I'm looking forward to the television series and I'm also hoping that there actually IS some truth to the Old Republic movie rumor. I'd rather see a cool restart in the Old Republic where there's absolutely no limitations than to see Episodes 7-9.

Happy Birthday Star Wars.
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Postby Evil Hobbit on Fri May 25, 2007 1:58 pm

The more star wars movies the better. I just need the hype and kick of anticipating a Star Wars release on the big screen. I have to see that lucasfilm logo and then BENG John Williams theme and a new adventure begins. It's my drugs.
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Postby monorail77 on Fri May 25, 2007 2:08 pm

New movie is just a rumour, what a shocker.

But Happy Birthday to Star Wars anyway, the grand old daddy of the summer blockbuster.

Um, Ok, that title probably goes to Jaws.

Um, Star Wars, the grand old daddy of the summer space opera blockbuster. Yeah, that'll do.
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Postby Nordling on Fri May 25, 2007 2:24 pm

I was reading through the many posts in this thread. It's a damn good discussion.
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Postby Keepcoolbutcare on Fri May 25, 2007 2:35 pm

Fried Gold wrote:A good article about Simon Pegg and his views on the films.

http://www.starwars.com/community/news/rocks/news20070420.html


The second season of the show came out just after The Phantom Menace, a film which, I'm sorry to say, I found immensely disappointing," Pegg continues. "Needless to say, Tim felt the same way and in the opening episode 'Time' burns his Star Wars stuff on a funeral pyre. The scene recreates exactly the moment when Luke burns the body of his father at the end of Return of the Jedi. I think it reflected the feelings of many fans


that scene sent me into a paroxysm of laughter.
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Postby wonkabar on Fri May 25, 2007 2:56 pm

Nordling wrote:Happy birthday, indeed. I will always be glad of STAR WARS and the impact it had on my young life.

BUT...

I am thoroughly burned out now. As the saying goes, "How can we miss you if you don't go away?" STAR WARS has permeated the culture so completely since 1997's re-release that I pretty much cringe whenever I see SW stuff now. Except for the funny Internet stuff, I pretty much avoid it. I'm not sure if I'll watch the TV show. I'm not saying I'm done with SW, but... yeah. I think I might be done with SW.


Evil Hobbit wrote:The more star wars movies the better. I just need the hype and kick of anticipating a Star Wars release on the big screen. I have to see that lucasfilm logo and then BENG John Williams theme and a new adventure begins. It's my drugs.


I think I'm kinda over SW too....but if there were another movie to come out, with a really good director at the helm....I'd see it. I wouldn't let myself get too excited about it before-hand (those days are over) but I would be happy when I got to the theater.

I'm not sure if i was being sarcastic or deadly-serious with my post on the mother-site about "several more SW movies in the works" being a good idea. I feel like....it could go either way, or I could go either way. On one hand I think I would be fine if SW just went away, on the other I kinda wish something would come along and sway me back into the fold....I don't know.
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Postby Cpt Kirks 2pay on Fri May 25, 2007 3:33 pm

Yeah bwoay!! This is the Star Wars film that I always wanted. Well, a trilogy of SW films anyway. To go back and cover the discovery of the Force and the War Between the Jedis and the Sith before The Old Republic was formed.

If this is true then I don't think anything could make me happier. If not, well, then I think inevitability will take it's course and one day these will happen. I think in the very least, George Lucas before he dies should write the screenplays for these films but let someone else take over and direct.

Fark it, he does the Prequels on his computer, he could do all the other producing work on these new films from his own home whilst the grafter crew do all the rest.

Meanwhile, forgodsakes man. Let Spielberg direct at LEAST one of them!!!
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Postby Fried Gold on Fri May 25, 2007 3:44 pm

It doesn't look like the "new Star Wars prequel movie" is true. Just a convention rumour, brought about by Lucasfilm saying "something big is going to be revealed this weekend!!!!!!".

The something is more than likely a Clone Wars trailer.

I can see the live-action TV series being able to have to scope to tell stories right across the full breadth of the history.
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Postby Cpt Kirks 2pay on Fri May 25, 2007 3:47 pm

Yeah but it won't. It'll just superficially concentrate on some unknown Jedi characters between Eps 3-4 who 1. We know will die anyway. 2. From the Prequels looks of things, will probably be boring characters.

It really feels like a waste of screen time.

As for the MOVIE, well they could also be talkign about the TV Movie Pilot for the series that they were talking about a short while ago.
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Postby wonkabar on Fri May 25, 2007 4:50 pm

I don't know, I kinda like the idea of, at least the TV show... taking place between 3 and 4. There's still some gaps that could be filled.

As far as movies....those rumours recently about Lucas asking Ford if he would be interested in playing Solo again. The stuff that Hamill supposedly said about Lucas telling him to keep himself free to work in 2000-something. I can't help but think that Lucas is still toying with the notion of doing some post-Ep.6 stuff. Though he might never admit it. If Lucasfilm produced more SW movies it would guarantee work to ILM etc./provide fodder for the other divisions, games etc. for years to come. I think even he felt TPM and AOTC didn't turn out quite like he hoped and maybe a couple more flicks in the vein of OT might bring balance. I'm sure he wouldn't direct again, and he might distribute the films in unusual ways...TV/IMAX/3D/DVD/WEB etc......I just get the feeling that he has an itch to do some form of post-ROTJ feature-length SW. Maybe something akin to Shadows of the Empire, only with an actual production behind the madness this time. I could be totally wrong, but I'm getting a "more movies of some kind or another in some fashion or another" vibe from the Lucas-machine.
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Postby Nordling on Fri May 25, 2007 5:04 pm

The only way STAR WARS should survive is if Lucas releases his grip on the creative aspects of the films and lets other writers and directors take a shot at it.

But the fact is, if Lucas really does consider EMPIRE to be the worst of the series, and if he insists on having full creative control of his universe, I don't see anything improving.

Here's the thing - in the OT, you really, truly gave a shit about those characters. They weren't following some set path. And I know, yeah, the Prequels had to follow that path, but Jesus, give me someone to relate to or to sympathize with. I cared NOTHING for anyone, save Palpatine. Hell, by the time the third film rolled around, I wanted him to win, because he's the only character in the trilogy that has a genuine fucking arc. He's power-hungry. He subtly manipulates, through politics and intrigue, his way to power. Plus, the performance lives up to the role. McDiarmid puts it in the eyes, so to speak, i.e. you believe him when he says lines like "Learn the ways of the dark side of the Force, and you will save your wife from certain death." Look at McDiarmid when he says that line - it's Palpatine, gleefully twisting the blade in Anakin's heart. In the old days, if he had a mustache, he'd twirl it, and I mean that as a compliment. McDiarmid is the only actor to get what these movies are. To everyone else, it's all so much pomp and circumstance. Where's the fun? Where's the wonder? There's no "I know" moment in the entire Prequel trilogy. Everything's so goddamned laborious.

It's funny, I said I might be done with SW, but I can't think of a series so damn fascinating in its failure, and so frustrating, because the problems it has? THEY ARE EASY FIXES. You can even keep the basic plot (although I would never make Anakin a child at first). The way Palpatine subtly takes power and transforms the government to the Empire is the single best writing of the Prequels. It's done subtly, but intelligently, and you can see the characters being manipulated like puppet strings. But you're supposed to root for them to break free of those strings, and because of the wooden acting and the wooden dialogue that Lucas gives them, you kinda start thinking that they deserve their fate. In the OT, you root for Luke, Han, Lando, and Leia. In the PT? I can't wait for the frumpy Jedi to fall. I'm not supposed to root for that. It's supposed to be a tragedy, sure. But it doesn't feel like one. There's only a few brief moments during Order 66, when you see the scope of the whole thing, that I felt even a little twinge of tragedy, and none of that was with the main characters. Only Yoda and Palpatine get good portrayals in it.

This was way more than I intended to write, so yeah, SW still has power over me, I guess.
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Postby wonkabar on Fri May 25, 2007 5:24 pm

I feel you, I'm sick of SW, yet I still feel compelled to talk about it....it's more like an affliction.

Man, how I would love to go avid-shit on the prequels!

Basically, the virgin-birth, midichlorians, forbidden-love...all that stuff...didn't really add up to much at the end of the day. I think you could cut ALL of it out and it wouldn't make much of a difference except to improve and streamline the overall story. Oh, and all that stuff about electing queens and Nabboo's democracy.... edit around that crap as well. I didn't need the "princess" part of Leia explaned away when I was a kid. Padme should have been queen period. nothing more needed to be said.

Anyway, I could go on all day....it's sick.

Oh, and yeah, I was totally rooting for Palpatine all the way too....the Jedi were dicks.

Bring back Kurtz, Kersner, McQuarrie, and those two editors who appeared in Empire of Dreams (forgot their names) the ones who touched up A New Hope.....bring 'em all back, for just one more movie.....then I might get excited again
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Postby Chairman Kaga on Fri May 25, 2007 5:30 pm

wonkabar wrote: I didn't need the "princess" part of Leia explaned away when I was a kid. Padme should have been queen period. nothing more needed to be said.

But isn't she a princess because of her adoptive dad not because her mother was elected queen?
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Postby Nordling on Fri May 25, 2007 5:35 pm

And why is that? Is Bail Organa a king? It's never said. It's little inconsistencies like that that piss me off.
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Postby Chairman Kaga on Fri May 25, 2007 5:37 pm

I'm confused....so one way it's over explaining things then another way it's under explaining things?
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Postby Nordling on Fri May 25, 2007 5:44 pm

It overexplains when it doesn't need to, and underexplains when it does. Granted, how Leia got her princess title isn't that important. But all the hoohah about why Jedi disappear when they die, midichlorians, hell, even why the Emperor looks the way he does (I just thought he was old and evil, and that worked for me. Silly me, I guess), it's extraneous.
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Postby wonkabar on Fri May 25, 2007 5:47 pm

Chairman Kaga wrote:But isn't she a princess because of her adoptive dad not because her mother was elected queen?


See, this is what I'm talking about....Lucas overcomplicated and nerdified SW.

Princess Leia.....that's it, who cares, she was just "the princess" by birth I assumed. I didn't think "gee, she's just as fucked up as the Empire if she comes from a monarchy as opposed to a democracy" That stuff didn't cross people's minds back in the day. But it apparently crossed Lucas' mind. So much so in fact, that he had to come up with a.....fuck, I don't know... "monacracy"? "demonarchy"? Where the people of an entire planet "elect" 15 year old, maybe even 12 ("I was not the youngest queen ever elected") girls to queenship.....[LewisBlack]are you fuckn' me?[/LewisBlack]

It's wtf-things like this, scattered throughout the prequels (and ROTJ....the herald) that just drive me.....forget it....I'm over it.
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Postby Chairman Kaga on Fri May 25, 2007 5:47 pm

Doesn't sound like you're over it...
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Postby wonkabar on Fri May 25, 2007 5:50 pm

IPAMPILSH!
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Postby wonkabar on Fri May 25, 2007 6:00 pm

Nordling wrote: But all the hoohah about why Jedi disappear when they die, midichlorians, hell, even why the Emperor looks the way he does (I just thought he was old and evil, and that worked for me. Silly me, I guess), it's extraneous.


Exactly!


Like, I thought the Jedi(s) just disappeared when they died...like that was just their way....like...their magic or some shit. I didn't ponder what happened to Ben in ANH, so much as why he seemed to let it happen. Lucas tinkered with something that didn't need tinkering IMO....

and that Last-Crusade/Something Wicked the Way Comes Palpatine face-morph bullshit wasn't exactly what I had mind either
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Postby wonkabar on Sun May 27, 2007 10:20 pm

OMG! So, so, so, SO true!

I love this part...

My generation always held on to the detritus of our youth, but usually in an ironic way. Sure, we could quote Brady Bunch or One Day at a Time episodes to you, but it was part of our detached slacker personas (or so we told ourselves). But Star Wars was a different animal, and while much of the world moved on after Return of the Jedi, my generation held on to the trilogy as a cool signifier, a cultural touchstone. This might be hard for some younger people to believe, since Star Wars has rapidly become dweebier than Star Trek (original crew only), but at one point in the mid to late 90s, Star Wars was actually really hip.
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Postby Maui on Sun May 27, 2007 11:28 pm

Nordling wrote:and because of the wooden acting and the wooden dialogue


You must mean Hayden Christensen...painful to watch really. He joins the ranks of Ali McGraw and Candice Bergen for best wooden acting performances.

Just curious, anyone else find the love scenes between Natalie Portman and Hayden Christensen amusing. I started to laugh in the theatre, it was a cheesefest. At one point they were running through a grassy/flowery meadow - I thought I was watching Sound of Music, not Star Wars.

And don't get me wrong, I am a Star Wars fanatic, love them all, own them all. I just felt I had to put up with some unnecessary fluff and was a wee bit disappointed with Hayden's performance.
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Postby wonkabar on Sun May 27, 2007 11:34 pm

Maui wrote:
Just curious, anyone else find the love scenes between Natalie Portman and Hayden Christensen amusing. I started to laugh in the theatre, it was a cheesefest. At one point they were running through a grassy/flowery meadow - I thought I was watching Sound of Music, not Star Wars.



My theater was LTFAO...it was like it was supposed to be funny. Serious Gouda.
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Postby Maui on Sun May 27, 2007 11:45 pm

wonkabar wrote:
My theater was LTAO...it was like it was supposed to be funny. Serious Gouda.



hahahaha, sad and funny at the same time.

Titanic brought a similar chortle from me, with Leo and Kate - I guess I'm a harsh judge when it comes to the romantical scenes.

Atleast with Han Solo and Leia, there was chemistry on screen and the acting was credible.
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Postby wonkabar on Mon May 28, 2007 12:21 am

Maui wrote:Atleast with Han Solo and Leia, there was chemistry on screen


...and the chemistry between Luke and Leia wasn't bad either
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Postby Adam Balm on Mon May 28, 2007 12:22 am

eewwwww.
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Postby Peven on Mon May 28, 2007 12:37 am

check out this trailer for the new Clone Wars animated series.


http://starwars.com/video/view/000478.html
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Postby Adam Balm on Mon May 28, 2007 12:39 am

I didn't know there was a new Clone Wars video game coming out.
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Postby Maui on Mon May 28, 2007 11:27 am

wonkabar wrote:
...and the chemistry between Luke and Leia wasn't bad either



Now, see I was watching Star Wars Friday night, and that little bit of chemistry, now knowing that they are kin, is bothersome. Blah!

Did Luke live in a trailer park on Tatooine? 8)
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Postby wonkabar on Mon May 28, 2007 11:44 am

Well, Empire is even worse. Full-on tongue almost. And Luke seems to enjoy it, there's not even a Back to the Future moment. Good thing those two kids got separated from each other a little bit later, who knows what would would have happened. I shudder to think what went down after he put his arm around her at the end.
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Postby Peven on Mon May 28, 2007 12:33 pm

wonkabar wrote:Well, Empire is even worse. Full-on tongue almost. And Luke seems to enjoy it, there's not even a Back to the Future moment. Good thing those two kids got separated from each other a little bit later, who knows what would would have happened. I shudder to think what went down after he put his arm around her at the end.


that is what happens when you make up the story as you go along, despite Lucas's bullshit story about having the whole thing mapped out when he made the first film in '77.
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Postby King Psyz on Mon May 28, 2007 6:15 pm

I would really love to see George release the stranglehold on the franchise and hand it off to some talented young directors and writers to continue the story, go far far ahead, or visit the KOTOR universe.

But they need to wait 10 years. Let people get over the sting of the 'prequels'.

Then they need to start them in secret, don't let people know they're coming until you're about halfway through post production and let people know on Super Bowl Sunday with a giant teaser trailer. The world will implode on geek joy/trepidation and it will be the greatest memorial day weekend, all over again.
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The Great STAR WARS Discussion Thread

Postby bastard_robo on Tue May 29, 2007 4:52 am

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Postby wharto on Tue May 29, 2007 5:55 am

The prequels were fucking wank, ROTS aside which was not too bad at all, but as someone before me said Lucas needs to hand over control, however when Lucas snuffs it, will we see some KOTOR era movies? Or will we see even New Republic era films.

Christensen was pretty poor as Anakin, and Portman has ruined her own career, McGregor was at times wooden and occasionally he seemed to be trying to hard, McDiarmid was the main success of the prequels with an absolutely sterling performance. The script was poor and the reasoning behind Anakin's turn was weak.
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Postby monorail77 on Thu May 31, 2007 12:18 pm

wharto wrote:The prequels were fucking wank, ROTS aside which was not too bad at all, but as someone before me said Lucas needs to hand over control, however when Lucas snuffs it, will we see some KOTOR era movies? Or will we see even New Republic era films.

Christensen was pretty poor as Anakin, and Portman has ruined her own career, McGregor was at times wooden and occasionally he seemed to be trying to hard, McDiarmid was the main success of the prequels with an absolutely sterling performance. The script was poor and the reasoning behind Anakin's turn was weak.


Yup, that sums it up pretty nicely.

The really frustrating thing about the prequels is the hit and miss aspect. For example, the end battle of AOTC was great, as was the Jango-Obi-Wan stuff. The Anakin-Padme stuff was hideous. There are many more examples throughout the prequels. Thank goodness for DVD and the ability to pick and choose what to watch.
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Postby LeFlambeur on Thu May 31, 2007 9:42 pm

For me, watching the prequels are like listening to a singer who has a golden throat but a tin ear. There are moments of absolute genius mixed in with awkward, infuriating missteps. The most difficult part to accept was the way that Anakin was potrayed. In the original series, we identified with Luke, and in a strange way looked up to Vader. Dispite the fact that he was evil, there was something cool about him. He was in control, powerful. It should have been the same way with Anakin. They went for an James Dean type but I think they should have went for a young Orson Wells type. It is difficult to accept Anakin as a complete figure of pity. When he went ape shit on the sand-people it should have been a "fuck yeah" moment for the audience, implicating us in the violence, and then later horrifying us with his description. The scene alludes of course to the Searchers, but in Anakin there is none of Ethan Edwards' dark bravado. Instead the moment is lamented from the beginning. Anyway that's my two cents.
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