Best Disney Cartoon

[Doc Holliday]

Mike Mignila did character designs for Disney?

He also did a some a work for a the Hanna-Barbera, eh? He totally reinvigorated the Mignilla Gorilla character, eh?

When? Where?

Wow I think I under estimated these cartoons maybee.

It's a like a shooting the little fishies inna the barrel, no?

If I tried doing that, I'd be the guy missing the fish, shooting a hole in the barrel that the fish would flop out of and into the nearby river to safety.

And the moral of the story? Don't go off-topic I guess....

[DinoDeLaurentiis]

I can agree with Dino on the care taken in Snow White but in hindsight I dislike the inconsistency between the rotoscoped humans and the (in my opinion much better animated) dwarves.

To be fair, the rotoscoping inna the "Snow White," she was a not onna the same a level as a the rotoscoping say, inna Bakshi's "Lord of a the Rings," no? Inna "Snow White," the rotoscoping process, she was a used more as a the guide for a the animators... Disney's idea was a to have a the motions of a the Snow White anna the Prince a to be realistic motion inna contrast to a the dwarves, but also that a their motion was a to be enhanced anna turned inna to to a the most graceful anna beautiful movements, beyond a what a the live-action actors where a capable of, eh?

[DinoDeLaurentiis]

Dino wasn't that some issue where the author had worked for Disney at the time he wrote Kimba and as a result their "we own everything you produce while employed here" clause kicked in?

I donna know about a that, eh? You be a the judge:

http://www.kimbawlion.com/rant2.htm

[Chairman Kaga]

Oh yeah it wasn't straight roto like the aforementioned Bakshi or old Fleisher Supermans but it still bothers me because all of the humans go one way and the dwarves go the other ie compared to the very well animated squash and stretch like dwarves the humans always seemed sorta rigid and awkward. Of course the dwarves was really the start of the principles the 12 old men would pioneer before that it was all hose arms and legs etc.

[Chairman Kaga]

Dino wasn't that some issue where the author had worked for Disney at the time he wrote Kimba and as a result their "we own everything you produce while employed here" clause kicked in?

I donna know about a that, eh? You be a the judge:

http://www.kimbawlion.com/rant2.htm

Wow nevermind.....I remember being told it was a book originally not a 20 year old animated show...That makes it pretty obvious that they were probably going to remake it and then the rights fell through somehow.

[DinoDeLaurentiis]

Of course the dwarves was really the start of the principles the 12 old men would pioneer before that it was all hose arms and legs etc.

Alla true, alla true... which only makes it alla the more impressive of a the achievement, no? Anna to this a day, I still think a the animation of a the Queen/Old Hag, she some of a the finest character animation inna history, eh?

[John-Locke]

I want to see that short Disney did with Dali, looks weird.

The baseball one? Never went anywhere.....all that exist are some preliminary art work.

Really?

Then whats this?

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1462300

They finished it off a few years ago and it plays festivals, click the link for clips.

[Doc Holliday]

Of course the dwarves was really the start of the principles the 12 old men would pioneer before that it was all hose arms and legs etc.

Alla true, alla true... which only makes it alla the more impressive of a the achievement, no? Anna to this a day, I still think a the animation of a the Queen/Old Hag, she some of a the finest character animation inna history, eh?

She was the first cartoon to scare the absolute Bejesus outta me....

........now, who wants an apple?

[cap]

Most of the newer stuff isn't bad strictly because they actually starting writing in two levels of humor.

Also good sight gags help.

[Chairman Kaga]

I want to see that short Disney did with Dali, looks weird.

The baseball one? Never went anywhere.....all that exist are some preliminary art work.

Really?

Then whats this?

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1462300

They finished it off a few years ago and it plays festivals, click the link for clips.

Awesome I never heard anything about this.

[Shane]

I want to see that short Disney did with Dali, looks weird.

The baseball one? Never went anywhere.....all that exist are some preliminary art work.

Really?

Then whats this?

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1462300

They finished it off a few years ago and it plays festivals, click the link for clips.

that looks interesting, I'd like to check it out.

[Seppuku]

I'd say Pulp Fiction (Buena Vista), but I'd be lying, as much as I like that film I probably prefer The Jungle Book more. Last time I caught it, on a 500 mile coach ride from Cairo to...some other place in Egypt whose name I've forgotten, it made me forget about the dysentery, forget about the lack of salt in my body, and forget about the fact that I was on a coach with fifty other people in the sweltering heat hobbling through Egypt. That was quite an experience. I hadn't seen it since I was about 9.

I still know every lyric to I Wanna be Like You and The Bear Necessities (if it's not spelt like that it should be).

[Fievel]

For me it's Fantasia 2000.

The Rhapsody In Blue sketch has the best marriage of audio and visual. Everything just lines up perfectly in that bit. Simply awesome.

The Firebird has some of the most un-Disney animation, aside from loving the music, the animation hooks me in as well.

Some of the bits in Fantasia 2000 fall flat for me - the Tin Soldier bit just bores me to tears. But then you have the flamingo playing with the yo-yo, and that really makes up for it. Donald Duckj playing Noah? Very cool, but again the music is half the joy. They use Elgar's Pomp and Circumstance (you know, the graduation tune) and I had no idea there was so much more to that music than just the march! Good stuff.

[RogueScribner]

the black cauldron

It's the best disney by far in my eyes

i also think oliver and Company was another good one that didnt do aswell as it should have

I remember loving The Black Cauldron when I was a kid, but I watched it again a few years ago and absolutely hated it. It was just a confusing mess.

As for Oliver & Company, it made $54 million in its initial release, which at the time was the highest box office gross of any animated film in its first theatrical run.

[colonel_lugz]

the black cauldron

It's the best disney by far in my eyes

i also think oliver and Company was another good one that didnt do aswell as it should have

I remember loving The Black Cauldron when I was a kid, but I watched it again a few years ago and absolutely hated it. It was just a confusing mess.

As for Oliver & Company, it made $54 million in its initial release, which at the time was the highest box office gross of any animated film in its first theatrical run.

WHOA! Just had flash back which knocked be out of my chair. Oliver and frickin' Company man!!!! WOW!! so totally forgot about that. I loved that film as a kid, I remeber I had all the metal pin badges of each of the characters.

Having trouble placing the Black Cauldron though.........hmmmmmmmm

[RogueScribner]

was never really a big fan of Disney Films, especially the new ones althought Beauty and the Beast was good apart from the songs.

"Apart from the songs?" I absolutely love every frame of music Ashman and Menken composed for their Disney ventures, especially Beauty and the Beast. A lot of animated movies with songs in them, well, the songs seem forced and pedantic. Ashman's lyrics were often clever and Menken's music very heartfelt. Sometimes I'll listen to the "West Wing" track on repeat, it's that good!

[athenabodicea]

Ok... I can't believe no one has mentioned Aladdin... This is definitely one of my favorites...
I am also a big fan of The Emperor's New Groove it is funny as hell....
I'll also go with Atlantis which I can see has been mentioned by several other zoner's...
Though I enjoyed The Lion King, I have to say that Lion King 1 1/2 is the funniest Disney cartoon by far imo....I usually hate the sequels for all Disney movies but Lion King 1 1/2 is a must see which I recommend highly to anyone who has not seen it yet...

As for Disney Pixar: Finding Nemo, Bugs Life & Toy Story 1 & 2 are practically worn out....

[colonel_lugz]

i mentioned it.....*sniff*

[tfactor]

I want to see that short Disney did with Dali, looks weird.

The baseball one? Never went anywhere.....all that exist are some preliminary art work.

Really?

Then whats this?

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1462300

They finished it off a few years ago and it plays festivals, click the link for clips.

this is awesome, and I thank all zone members for bringing this to my attention. I am a huge Dali fan and have been since my early teens when I first saw "Swans reflecting elephants"


I loved his vision and his amazing abstract ability to create these mirror images. Now being as big a fan as I am you would think I would have known about the disney/dali initiative, but no.

Anway I think this looks really cool, and I can't believe in the second clip that he had done with aimation what he so often did with his art, in creating this mirror image effect.

Thanks JL & other Dali fans, you've made my day

[athenabodicea]

i mentioned it.....*sniff*

I'm sorry Lugz... There it was, the 2nd post on the thread..

Emporers New Groove.....soooo fucking funny and truely underrated!!!

"More Broccolli??"

I've not been in the zone too much this past week & so I have found myself speed reading to catch up...

Btw I love the songs too & actually have the soundtrack for Aladdin... (let the flaming begin)
But it really puts me in a good mood whenever I listen to it..

[colonel_lugz]

I also have the OST for Aladdin and it rules and I stand by you Athena, more people need to realise how good it is.....My fave is A Whole New World, play repeat play repeat play repeat!

[tfactor]

ow sorry to inadvertently thread jack there with my enormous Dali post, but Emporer's new groove & aladdin are absolutely fantastic. I'll go once more and throw Lion King 1 1/2 in there as well. That movie kills me and sorry if it was already mentioned, unlike athena I can't speed read

an ipampilash scene:
[Kuzco and Pacha are tied to a tree branch floating in a river]
Pacha: Uh-oh.
Kuzco: Don't tell me. We're about to go over a huge waterfall.
Pacha: Yep.
Kuzco: Sharp rocks at the bottom?
Pacha: Most likely.
Kuzco: Bring it on.

[athenabodicea]

an ipampilash scene:
[Kuzco and Pacha are tied to a tree branch floating in a river]
Pacha: Uh-oh.
Kuzco: Don't tell me. We're about to go over a huge waterfall.
Pacha: Yep.
Kuzco: Sharp rocks at the bottom?
Pacha: Most likely.
Kuzco: Bring it on.

Very nice hunny bunny..

[Lord Voldemoo]

I used to own the Aladdin soundtrack too (I think i lost the CD in one of my many moves), so you guys are not alone...

Oliver and Co., Robin Hood, The Fox and the Hound are 3 of my faves...

[athenabodicea]

I used to own the Aladdin soundtrack too (I think i lost the CD in one of my many moves), so you guys are not alone...

Very nice Moo...

How was "out of the country" anyway???
Nice to see you back...

[RogueScribner]

Aladdin is good, and I also own the soundtrack, but I don't think it's really in the same league of the other films that came out around that time. I probably feel that way due to Robin Williams, but still, dems my thoughts.

[minstrel]

Almost all of the characters and most of the plot was stolen from Nadia: secret of Blue Water.
web.neomedia.it/queensquier/nadia-atlantis-I.htm
I still like it though

When I watched Atlantis, I thought I was watching Stargate all over again. It's basically the same plot. In fact, the opening sequences (main character introductions, etc.) are almost verbatim the same script. Emmerich and Devlin could sue Disney for plagiarism, IMHO.

I thought Stargate was pretty good, but Atlantis sucked. And it doubly sucked because it was a ripoff.

[Lord Voldemoo]

How was "out of the country" anyway???
Nice to see you back...

Absolutely great, Costa Rica's beautiful. I'll post some pics in the Wherefore art thou Voldemoo thread later...

[DinoDeLaurentiis]

I probably feel that way due to Robin Williams, but still, dems my thoughts.

Like it or a not, Robin Williams, he change a the way a the modern Hollywoord animated features, they made up unna'til a this a very day, no?

Donna forget, before a the Aladdin, the biggest-name voice inna the Little Mermaid, she was a the goddamn Buddy Hackett, no? It was a not unna'til a that putz Williams, he make a with a the funny anna now EVERY goddamn feature, they have a the comedians anna the pop-culture references, eh?

[athenabodicea]

How was "out of the country" anyway???
Nice to see you back...

Absolutely great, Costa Rica's beautiful. I'll post some pics in the Wherefore art thou Voldemoo thread later...

Very cool... I look forward to seeing them....

[Bob Samonkey]

How was "out of the country" anyway???
Nice to see you back...

Absolutely great, Costa Rica's beautiful. I'll post some pics in the Wherefore art thou Voldemoo thread later...

Very cool... I look forward to seeing them....

There IS a Wherefore art thou Voldemoo thread? Is it like Where's Waldo where we have to find you every week?

[Lord Voldemoo]

There IS a Wherefore art thou Voldemoo thread? Is it like Where's Waldo where we have to find you every week?

lately it feels like it, between moving and the CR trip my life has been a bit tumultuous lately...

[Bob Samonkey]

Life on the moove.











Oh God I am sorry about that.

[RogueScribner]

I probably feel that way due to Robin Williams, but still, dems my thoughts.

Like it or a not, Robin Williams, he change a the way a the modern Hollywoord animated features, they made up unna'til a this a very day, no?

Donna forget, before a the Aladdin, the biggest-name voice inna the Little Mermaid, she was a the goddamn Buddy Hackett, no? It was a not unna'til a that putz Williams, he make a with a the funny anna now EVERY goddamn feature, they have a the comedians anna the pop-culture references, eh?

I think you're right. I'm not really into the modern fare too much. The Shrek movies are disposable. The likes of Ice Age and Robots are middle-of-the-road entertainment. If it wasn't for Pixar, modern animation would be in serious trouble. Come to think of it, it is.

[papalazeru]

Sorry, turned up late to this Topic *huff huff*

I have to agree with the original topic Author, The Fox and the Hound is by far one of the better Disney productions. It was incredibly heart warming to see the relationship between two friends without it degenerating into a sickly sweet or "Falling in love" ending (even though I do like those too).

From the Newer Disney......I'd go for...well....

JUST ABOUT EVERY ALAN MENKEN one going....great rousing and sensitive scores, these include aladdin, Little mermaid....Pocahon......ok forget that one, but generally, they are all great.

Gotta love the singalongs, after a night at the pub with the lads we all like to initiate a singalong of "Part of your world" from Little mermaid.

You know something, the question of which disney cartoon is actually getting too hard. There are too many good points in so many films.

Dammit! Now I've got to go watch Little Mermaid again....seeya peoples.
*Whirr of DVD drive*
<Music>
"I'll tell you a tale of the bottomless blue
And it's hey to the starboard, heave ho
Look out, lad, a mermaid be waiting for you
In mysterious fathoms below........"

(*Grabs a box of tissues and cries*)

[Chairman Kaga]

Of course the dwarves was really the start of the principles the 12 old men would pioneer before that it was all hose arms and legs etc.

Alla true, alla true... which only makes it alla the more impressive of a the achievement, no? Anna to this a day, I still think a the animation of a the Queen/Old Hag, she some of a the finest character animation inna history, eh?

ICOMPLETELYAGREEILASH

[Peven]

most old school Disney animation is pretty solid entertainment, my favorites being Pinnochio and Snow White, though Cinderella is weak, imo. Fantasia is a real piece of gorgeous art, both to the ear and eye. although they strayed from the source material, "The Rescuers" was a pretty nifty flick that i saw as a kid in the theatre, with Bob Newhart and Zsa Zsa Gabore inspired choices voicing the leads.

i will always hold a grudge for the unforgiveable butcher job Disney did on "The Black Cauldron", which was written by N e w b e r r y Award winning author, Lloyd Alexander, one of my favorite authors when i was a kid. "The Black Cauldron" was actually the second book in a five book series by Alexander, which, btw, i am currently reading with my two youngest sons. The books are steeped in Welsh mythology with morality and ethics themes in relation to a boy's journey to manhood, and have a distinct edge to them, which Disney turned into a cute N fuzzy kiddy movie that went for cheesy laughs.

not really a big fan of the musical 90's creations, since they have so many cliche, barbie-type themes, and Disney kept following the same lame formula obviously geared towards girls ages 4-14, with little or no concern for entertaining young boys. Disney was more interested in marketing licensing for girls' toys and clothes attached to their movies than they were interested in producing quality animated films.

Pixar, imo, was the shot in the arm animated films needed, because Disney was killing the genre with their milktoast, paper thin, ultra pc, uber-commercialized approach. and now Disney has gobbled up Pixar. i'm crossing my fingers in hope that doesn't mean we get a cgi version of "Little Mermaid IV: the squid queen cometh", or "Lion King V: prince of heyenas" or some shit like that.

[Chairman Kaga]

Peven you must not be keeping up....search around for the thread devoted solely to the Disney/Pixar thing...Lasetter is already over seeing various Disney feature operations including stopping work on Toy Story 3 as well as nixing all future direct to dvd sequels in various stages of production.

[Peven]

Kaga, i think you need to recheck your info, because Toy Story 3 is most certainly NOT dead or stopped. on the very thread you refer to i posted an article stating that plans for a Toy Story 3 are going forward, only not with the scrpt that Disney had been working on. proof is in the pudding and time will tell just how much being devoured by Disney will water down Pixar's level of quality. like i said, i'm crossing my fingers and hoping for the best. but considering Disney's track record over the last couple decades, i'm prepared for the worst.

[RogueScribner]

not really a big fan of the musical 90's creations, since they have so many cliche, barbie-type themes, and Disney kept following the same lame formula obviously geared towards girls ages 4-14, with little or no concern for entertaining young boys. Disney was more interested in marketing licensing for girls' toys and clothes attached to their movies than they were interested in producing quality animated films.

Do you lump Aladdin, The Lion King, Hercules, and Tarzan into that group? That was half their output in the '90s!

[Peven]

not really a big fan of the musical 90's creations, since they have so many cliche, barbie-type themes, and Disney kept following the same lame formula obviously geared towards girls ages 4-14, with little or no concern for entertaining young boys. Disney was more interested in marketing licensing for girls' toys and clothes attached to their movies than they were interested in producing quality animated films.

Do you lump Aladdin, The Lion King, Hercules, and Tarzan into that group? That was half their output in the '90s!

yeah, i do. if you want, i'll go movie by movie to explain why they were pretty shallow, commercialized tripe, that showed little respect to the source material in the examples of Aladdin, Tarzan and Hercules, or should i say Heracles, too.

[RogueScribner]

not really a big fan of the musical 90's creations, since they have so many cliche, barbie-type themes, and Disney kept following the same lame formula obviously geared towards girls ages 4-14, with little or no concern for entertaining young boys. Disney was more interested in marketing licensing for girls' toys and clothes attached to their movies than they were interested in producing quality animated films.

Do you lump Aladdin, The Lion King, Hercules, and Tarzan into that group? That was half their output in the '90s!

yeah, i do. if you want, i'll go movie by movie to explain why they were pretty shallow, commercialized tripe, that showed little respect to the source material in the examples of Aladdin, Tarzan and Hercules, or should i say Heracles, too.

I wasn't debating the quality of the films so much as your saying that all the musical Disney films in the '90s had "so many cliche, barbie-type themes" and that everything they did was geared towards girls. I think they were doing their best to appeal to both genders and thus milk everyone out of their money. The films I listed were more adventure type films and definitely had a stronger male presence than the other fairy tale type films of the time.

[Peven]

they were most definately cliched, barbie-type movies geared toward young girls, take it from a parent of young kids during that time period, who used to be dragged to the Disney store at the local mall regularly. even The Lion King, Hercules, and Tarzan appealed more to girls than boys (which isn't that surprising considering the strongest characters represented in them were the female characters). when Holloween came around, the only boys wearing Disney stuff were toddlers and their mothers picked their costumes; you didn't see 9 yr old boys wearing Simba costumes.

[Shane]

I think they need to go back to shakespaer, only this time without the lion cubs. Look at most of the classic Disney, it was classic tales, they need to get back to that. And Disney doing Shakespear geared for kids with animated people would be interesting. Possibly Titus this time around.

[Brocktune]

FANTASIA

Which proved that the mouse had his nose in some sweet
(and extremely powerful) mushrooms.

dude, im just going to stop posting altogether, as you are going to say it for me.

fantasia is a masterpiece, mushrooms or not. disney has never produced anything quite as good.

I've seen Fantasia 2000 laying around, is it the same film as Fantasia or isit a different movie all together?

ok, i take back what i said before, as i must disagree with ZZS for once (mark your calenders, this doesnt happen too often). fantasia 2000, while not as good as the original, is probably the greatest film disney has produced in the last 20 years easy (not necessarily counting the pixar stuff). my biggest complaints about it, are that it wasnt long enough. the animation was top notch, their musical selections were impeccable, and comercially speaking, it doesnt seem to be the kind of thing that would be marketable today, yet they did it anyway. it reminded me of when disney used to be a hallmark of quality. if there is one thing i would bitch about though, it would be the re-inclusion of paul dukas's the sorcerers apprentice. fantasia 200 was short enough as it was, but then to have a good portion of the time be eaten up by a vignette we already saw 50 years ago, well it was a little weak. i love the short, but weak nonetheless. the one that really stands out to me is the pines of rome by resphigi. the piece is goosebump inducing, and the animation is just surreal enough to remind you not to forget the mushrooms, yet not so much that you feel that you need them.

i am pretty much a fan of disney from the beginning, up through aladdin, and then fantasia 2000, and the pixar stuff, sans nemo. after aladdin, it just seemed that quality wasnt important to disney anymore. i know there are those that would argue that beauty and the beast is one of if not their best work, but im just not feeling it. pochahontas, mulan, the lion king, weak.
that being said, a couple of my personal faves have always been

the adventures of ichabod and mr. toad
sword in the stone
robin hood
the jungle book
mary poppins
bedknobs and broomsticks
i think those last two count, because they feature animation so prominently.

oh, and i also loved that short they did with that stupid bear, where that park ranger makes them pick up trash to get to eat some kind of gloppy looking stew, and they sing a really great swingin tune thats real brassy. love that one.

i also loved der fuhrers face, and education for death. i could pass on the menstruation one, though.

[RogueScribner]

Every town
Has its ups and downs
Sometimes the ups
Outnumber the downs
But not in Nottingham

*sniff*

[Chairman Kaga]

I thought Beauty and the Beast was before Aladdin....

Kaga, i think you need to recheck your info

Hey I am only going off reports from AWN and alumni friends of mine...

[RogueScribner]

Beauty and the Beast 1991
Aladdin 1992

[Brocktune]

Beauty and the Beast 1991
Aladdin 1992

you are absolutely right, sir. i stand corrected. i dont know why i always think aladdin came right before B and the B, when i know full well that it was the little mermaid. however, chronological inconsistencies aside, my opinion on the two films remains unchanged.

[monorail77]

of the old, if I have to choose only one, I'd go with Pinnocchio

of the new, The Lion King (best opening sequence, ever)

but, I'd have to specially mention the Fantasia films (both of them) as being really great as well. I don't put them in the same category as they lack the traditional Disney feature through-line narrative (and before you call me on this, I am aware that "features" like Melody Time lacked thru narratives too. Come to think of it, I like Melody Time!)