The Official X-Thread (Now w/ Messiah Complex!)

[Lady Sheridan]

No kidding! I had a t-shirt on--I skipped the sandals luckily, but I left the pink "300 panel" hoodie at home because it was so sunny when I left. And then I shivered all day because the office A/C was turned to Siberia!

It feels like winter outside. September's in with a bang!

"You sick bitch" heheheh, my curiosity is piqued. I bet it's got something to do with that Pg-13 cover.

[DennisMM]

That would be telling.

[Lady Sheridan]

Wow!!

I absolutely love childish Wolverine! What a great twist. I knew it was coming and yet the actual scene "I'm the best at what I do" caught me totally off guard so that I laughed out loud. The chambermaid speech in the tree was brilliant--as well as him showing up with his shirt buttoned to the collar and his hair slicked down! He's gone all the way! Poor guy, he's never going to live this one down.

And yes, I very much enjoyed "You sick bitch" in context--poor Scott Summers. It's probably the only time I've truly felt bad for Cyclops. (Sorry, Whedo. ) My only complaint was the truly bad job the otherwise brilliant Cassaday did drawing Jean Gray...she looked like a dude with red hair.

And now, to join you all in Spoiler Land...

Dennis, I think your theory is a VERY good one, but I think I'm half with Ribbons...if she can do what she did to Wolverine and Beast without a body, why would she need it? Especially as it was so frail and messed up in New X-Men. I think that it is very likely though, but Whedon would have to have a really really good reason--which I wouldn't doubt.

My first thought was that it was something Phoenix related, but I don't think it is. But that leads me to wonder, what about a Stepford Cuckoo, like Esme, or Quinten Quire? Or something related to the brain, who's name I have spaced, that Cassandra was carrying around in New X-Men?

I think the Colossus reveal is really intriguing. I liked how Whedon tried to trick you into thinking it would be the Phoenix with the "destroyer of worlds" comment. It reminds me of the whole "Prophecy" storyline in Angel and how that turned out...I do think we're in for a bigger surprise on that one.

[Ribbons]

And now, to join you all in Spoiler Land...

Dennis, I think your theory is a VERY good one, but I think I'm half with Ribbons...if she can do what she did to Wolverine and Beast without a body, why would she need it? Especially as it was so frail and messed up in New X-Men. I think that it is very likely though, but Whedon would have to have a really really good reason--which I wouldn't doubt.

My first thought was that it was something Phoenix related, but I don't think it is. But that leads me to wonder, what about a Stepford Cuckoo, like Esme, or Quinten Quire? Or something related to the brain, who's name I have spaced, that Cassandra was carrying around in New X-Men?

I think the Colossus reveal is really intriguing. I liked how Whedon tried to trick you into thinking it would be the Phoenix with the "destroyer of worlds" comment. It reminds me of the whole "Prophecy" storyline in Angel and how that turned out...I do think we're in for a bigger surprise on that one.

Thas' what I'm talkin' about. Plus:

[size=0]Even if she can do all that stuff without the aid of a body (that she may in fact be in possession of already), I can understand wanting to have your body back. Not saying I've ever been ethereal before, but a case can be made for Nova wanting to exist in her old form again. But. BUT! Why would the Hellfire Club care?

********************************

Nova: I need you to raid the X-Mansion in a dangerous and potentially deadly, clandestine mission!

Shaw: Why the deuce would we do that?

Nova: Because.... I need my body back!

Shaw: Well... we WOULD be infinitely more powerful with one of the world's most powerful telepaths on our side.

Nova: Actually, I can do everything I could do with my body without it.

Shaw: Then why should we help you?

Nova: Uhh... umm... because I really want it?

Shaw: Hahaha! Good one, old gal! I'm going to fix myself a brandy.

Negasonic Teenage Warhead: Witty/creepy non sequitir

**********************************************

Unless it turns out that she's somehow forcing them to recover the body for her. But then, why can't she just do it herself? But then again, she needs someone to open that box-a-majiggee for her. Still, I have to imagine that whatever's in there is of interest to the entire Hellfire Club, and I'm skeptical that her body would interest them all that much. But either explanation is possible, I guess, under certain circumstances. I dunno. I'm still loving the story to pieces, and can't wait to see where it goes.[/size]

[Lady Sheridan]

[size=0]
Unless it turns out that she's somehow forcing them to recover the body for her. But then, why can't she just do it herself? But then again, she needs someone to open that box-a-majiggee for her. Still, I have to imagine that whatever's in there is of interest to the entire Hellfire Club, and I'm skeptical that her body would interest them all that much. But either explanation is possible, I guess, under certain circumstances. I dunno. I'm still loving the story to pieces, and can't wait to see where it goes.[/size]

[size=0]Yes, they are looking for something to make them major players again. I can't imagine they would go to this much work just to help out a pal, or that Nova would either. With her power, wouldn't you just take over Emma Frost or something, like she did with Professor X? I would much rather be Emma Frost than an ugly bald midget.

It seems like that would be a rehash of New X-Men anyway...which is the strike against it being Quinten Quire. Level 5 mutant though he may be, it would be awfully reminiscent of Endsong.

And now for something else...what the hell is going on with the White Queen/Emma Frost split? I am afraid my expression matched Kitty's at that moment.
[/size]

[Keepcoolbutcare]

[size=0]

Nova: I need you to raid the X-Mansion in a dangerous and potentially deadly, clandestine mission!

Shaw: Why the deuce would we do that?

Nova: Because.... I need my body back!

Shaw: Well... we WOULD be infinitely more powerful with one of the world's most powerful telepaths on our side.

Nova: Actually, I can do everything I could do with my body without it.

Shaw: Then why should we help you?

Nova: Uhh... umm... because I really want it?

Shaw: Hahaha! Good one, old gal! I'm going to fix myself a brandy.

Negasonic Teenage Warhead: Witty/creepy non sequitir
[/size]

HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

oh man, I'm gonna be giggling about that one for a while...

[Keepcoolbutcare]

Lockheed?!?!?!

the beer can breakthrough.

"...I don't have claws".

Among the best issues Cassady has ever drawn. The perspective on two panels in particular really stood out.

and Maddog!, splayed Emma = Perfection.

page open now, thinking unsexy thoughts...

[MasterWhedon]

SPOILERS--DON'T READ UNTIL YOU'VE READ #17!!

Once again, we see why my boy Scott Summers is THE fucking man. That final reveal was so, so incredibly fucking badass, and a nice callback to when Xavier resorted to shooting Nova with the gun in New X-Men.

I just pray this doesn't mean he's lost his powers entirely. I'm hoping he'll just be able to control them now without the visor.

Lockheed was a surprise, but I find myself remember Kitty saying back in issue #1 or 2 that Lockheed was late in arriving at the mansion. Perhaps SWORD intercepted and put a little spell on our fair dragon.

The Wolverine beer moment is probably the single best in the whole issue. It's just perfect, perfect writing for that character.

I'm really liking the stuff with Ord and Danger too. It's criss-crossing nicely with the other stuff, and I can see it building to a head. Shit's gonna go big real soon.

Fuck yeah, Scott Summers.

[Keepcoolbutcare]

Once again, we see why my boy Scott Summers is THE fucking man. That final reveal was so, so incredibly fucking badass, and a nice callback to when Xavier resorted to shooting Nova with the gun in New X-Men.

fuck. yeah.

didn't know it even was a callback...

I just pray this doesn't mean he's lost his powers entirely. I'm hoping he'll just be able to control them now without the visor.

doesn't need it now that he's got the new found Punky Power...

The Wolverine beer moment is probably the single best in the whole issue. It's just perfect, perfect writing for that character.

I'm still lol'ing at that. Perfect writing and art.

my nominee for best comic of the month.

[MasterWhedon]

my nominee for best comic of the month.

Agreed. It saddens me to think it's ending soon.

But then we just step over to Runaways to get the Whedon fix...

[DennisMM]

Better to end than to burn out, as someone said up above. It's become the trend for cretors to step away after a short run. That bothers me, but at least the creators tell a story they want to tell, one they have strong feelings for. That's better than having a writer or team sitting and pondering, "WTF am I going to do for the next arc? Damn, the outline is due next week."

[Lady Sheridan]

Wait, how did I miss reading #17?

Shit, it's official. I am a retard.

[DennisMM]

It came out yesterday, Lady S.

[Lady Sheridan]

Oh good, the jury is still out on my retardation then.

Actually, what made me confused is when I googled it, it was listed as coming out on the 9th...

Still, if this keeps up, everyone's liable to think I am a blonde...

[DennisMM]

Actually, what made me confused is when I googled it, it was listed as coming out on the 9th...

Astonishing was announced as a bimonthly when it returned with #13; they wanted to avoid the long breaks between issues that characterized #1-12. Apparently, Whedon and Cassaday are far enough ahead that #17 could ship before the announced street date. It might have something to do with Ellis's slow progress on the last two issues of Planetary.

[MasterWhedon]

Once again, we see why my boy Scott Summers is THE fucking man. That final reveal was so, so incredibly fucking badass, and a nice callback to when Xavier resorted to shooting Nova with the gun in New X-Men.

fuck. yeah.

didn't know it even was a callback...

To clarify, I just looked up Nova's Wiki entry to refresh myself. The following happened during "E is for Extinction":

After she was able to rebuild herself, Cassandra returned with a vengeance. She convinced the last living relative of Bolivar Trask, Donald Trask III, to activate a pair of enormous wild Sentinels and send them to destroy the mutant homeland of Genosha, killing 16 million mutants. Cassandra duplicated Trask's DNA so she could also issue orders to the Sentinels, programmed to obey only those with the DNA of a Trask. Cassandra infected her own body with millions of nanosentinels just as she was captured by Cyclops and Wolverine.

Cassandra was taken to the X-Mansion, where she broke free and defeated most of the X-Men easily. Cassandra then put herself into Xavier's machine Cerebra (an enhanced version of Cerebro) and switched minds with her brother before Emma Frost snapped Cassandra's neck (Emma had been in Genosha teaching during the attack and witnessed her students massacred). Trapped in Cassandra's broken body, Xavier was unable to warn the X-Men before Cassandra, now in Xavier's body, shot him.

So, technically it was Nova (in Xavier's body) who shot Xavier (in Nova's body), but it's still is pretty creepy that Xavier kept a gun in his wheelchair.

[DennisMM]

Why not? His brain has been put out of commission enough times that a backup plan never hurts. The Chief of the Doom Patrol (another wheelchair leader, and the two groups appeared within a month of one another) kept one handy. He even had rockets in some of his wheelchairs.

[DennisMM]

Re: Astonishing X-Men #17, let's flash back to comments made after #16 was released.

think I know what's in the chamber the Hellfire Club can't open. Switching to SPOILER tinytext.

It's Cassandra Nova's body. Reasons for this theory:

1. As best I can determine, Nova has not appeared since "E is for Extinction" in New X-Men, except for her presence in the alternate-future continuity of "Here Comes Tomorrow," Grant Morrison's last story.

2. At the end of "E is for Extinction," Nova's intellect was reduced to that of a young child. She was seen in a "classroom," being taught by Xavier. This classroom was clearly a mental construct. Her body had to be kept somewhere, obviously in a secure location.

3. The entire point of Nova's mission against the team is to open that damned chamber, which she has referred to as the "manger," implying a being of great power is within.

4. I cannot remember seeing Nova touch/hold any person or object during the current story.

And now, to join you all in Spoiler Land...

Dennis, I think your theory is a VERY good one, but I think I'm half with Ribbons...if she can do what she did to Wolverine and Beast without a body, why would she need it? Especially as it was so frail and messed up in New X-Men. I think that it is very likely though, but Whedon would have to have a really really good reason--which I wouldn't doubt.

My first thought was that it was something Phoenix related, but I don't think it is. But that leads me to wonder, what about a Stepford Cuckoo, like Esme, or Quinten Quire? Or something related to the brain, who's name I have spaced, that Cassandra was carrying around in New X-Men?

I think the Colossus reveal is really intriguing. I liked how Whedon tried to trick you into thinking it would be the Phoenix with the "destroyer of worlds" comment. It reminds me of the whole "Prophecy" storyline in Angel and how that turned out...I do think we're in for a bigger surprise on that one.

Thas' what I'm talkin' about. Plus:

[size=0]Even if she can do all that stuff without the aid of a body (that she may in fact be in possession of already), I can understand wanting to have your body back. Not saying I've ever been ethereal before, but a case can be made for Nova wanting to exist in her old form again. But. BUT! Why would the Hellfire Club care?

********************************

Nova: I need you to raid the X-Mansion in a dangerous and potentially deadly, clandestine mission!

Shaw: Why the deuce would we do that?

Nova: Because.... I need my body back!

Shaw: Well... we WOULD be infinitely more powerful with one of the world's most powerful telepaths on our side.

Nova: Actually, I can do everything I could do with my body without it.

Shaw: Then why should we help you?

Nova: Uhh... umm... because I really want it?

Shaw: Hahaha! Good one, old gal! I'm going to fix myself a brandy.

Negasonic Teenage Warhead: Witty/creepy non sequitir

**********************************************

Unless it turns out that she's somehow forcing them to recover the body for her. But then, why can't she just do it herself? But then again, she needs someone to open that box-a-majiggee for her. Still, I have to imagine that whatever's in there is of interest to the entire Hellfire Club, and I'm skeptical that her body would interest them all that much. But either explanation is possible, I guess, under certain circumstances. I dunno. I'm still loving the story to pieces, and can't wait to see where it goes.[/size]

Going to spoiler tiny text again.

Once Katherine has removed the grub-thing from the chamber and been put to sleep, Nova says that none of them can imagine being in one of those slimy things. Perfection replies that she can, of course. She asks Nova about her new body and Nova indicates Katherine. Nova then tells the Club that once she's back in control and has dealt with her problem she will melt the Hellfire Club into nothingness. They are taken aback but don't wish to anger her at that moment. Obviously they have been led to believe there would be a much better outcome for them.

Perhaps Nova cannot transfer her mind into another body without switching bodies as she did with Xavier. She needs to have her physical body, unrestrained, placed in Cerebra to do the switcheroo with Kitty.

I didn't have all the details, but I TOLD YOU SO!

[DennisMM]

BUMP! See above and eat my dust, doubting Thomases and Thomasinas!

[Ribbons]

Well I'll be juggfuckled...

[MasterWhedon]

AXM #17 SPOILER!!

In case anyone wants to relive the MOTHERFUCKINGBADASSNESS of that last page of Astonishing #17, click HERE.

[DennisMM]

It's pretty cool, but it didn't hit me like "I want this thing off my lawn." I don't have a scan of that available.

Not to knock down the moment.

[Keepcoolbutcare]

Nova then tells the Club that once she's back in control and has dealt with her problem she will melt the Hellfire Club into nothingness. They are taken aback but don't wish to anger her at that moment. Obviously they have been led to believe there would be a much better outcome for them.

thought she was fucking with their minds in that scene, that's why they didn't get all bent out of shape at their imminent destruction. Fuck, they even looked kinda happy about it.

Good call, btw.

[Lady Sheridan]

I stand corrected--a tip of the hat to you, Dennis!

Going into Spoiler Land...

I still hope there's a REALLY good explanation for her wanting her body back. She's mind controlling Hellfire, managed to mangle the brains of Wolverine and Beast, PLUS seems to be behind the Emma/White Queen split without it. What else can it do for her? I can't believe there isn't a way for her to jump into Kitty...

And does anyone else wonder why Kitty? There must be something else she's after that she needs phasing powers for. I sense another arc!

I really liked the whole Kitty mind-warp. Here I was, expecting more of a show-down between her and the White Queen. Nope!

My favorite moment: "No more of that heathen funny talk!" I'm going to miss little James Howlett--I'm assuming the beer will have snapped him out of it by next issue.

And finally, a nod to Cyclops for using Lara Croft's weapon of choice. Well done, Scott Summers. Seeing a gun in X-Men is always so startling, isn't it?

[Bob Samonkey]

I really liked the X Files. Do you think the next movie is eve going to happen? Wha? Oh THAT X. I see. Um...well....goodbye!

[The Garbage Man]

The only problem I have with AXM #17 is the implication from the last page and the cover to #19 that Cyclops is going back to the New X-Men leather outfit.

Cassaday's Cyclops uniform was a great redesign and one of my favorite looks for Cyke.

[DennisMM]

Without the visor, why the suit? I'd still wear the visor just because it looks badass.

On the subject of visors: When did they decide Cyke had to touch his visor again to open it? For years he had controls built into his gloves as well as some sort of blink-control interface similar to those used by some quadriplegics. They invented these things because sometimes his hands are not able to reach his visor!

[The Garbage Man]

Without the visor, why the suit? I'd still wear the visor just because it looks badass.

Good point, it would look pretty funny without the visor.
Although I'm glad someone's finally doing something interesting with Cyclops and developing his character, I'm really going to miss the iconic look.

(I'd still wear the visor, too).

[Keepcoolbutcare]

think the "cure" serum, still in Hank's possession, will come into play at some point?

I'm not saying Hank's gonna be the one to figure it out, certainly not in his current condition, but something's gonna have to be done against Cassandra and her considerable abilities.

and it's not like Whedon is known for letting possible plot points go to waste.

re-reading older issues recently, he gave Perfection away with the white gloves. No, I didn't see it then, kicking myself now.

[DennisMM]

I just want to know who Perfection is. Is Emma, "the imposter," some sort of clone or alternate-timeline version? That would explain her slow conversion to "good."

[Lady Sheridan]

I echo Kitty on that one...Yeahbutwhat?!

I'm really hoping that Emma will end up being a double agent or somehow is working under the guidance of Xavier...I don't want her to be bad, which is funny, because I detest her. Maybe my sympathy is more for Cyclops and all who have trusted her.

[Doc Holliday]

Memo to self: Either buy the latest X-title the second it hits the shelf or stay the hell away from Whedons Av's/custom ranks in the meantime....

(damn you whedon)

ok - so #17 was cool, the momentum is swinging back....but damned if there ain't a whole bunch of stuff that the real Whedon has left himself to explain satisfactorily.

I do, however, have complete faith in the man - so I can't wait for #18...which is how it should be. If you need me I'll be camping outside the comic store, just in case it arrives early.....

[MasterWhedon]

Memo to self: Either buy the latest X-title the second it hits the shelf or stay the hell away from Whedons Av's/custom ranks in the meantime....

(damn you whedon)

Was I not subtle enough? I try to be subtle...

[DennisMM]

I will only read Astonishing. That's how much faith I have in Whedon and how little interest I have in the internecine goings-on of the X-books in general.

[Leckomaniac]

Just finished issue #17.

LETS HEAR IT FOR THE BOY!!!! (scott summers that is).

A very cool issue, one of the best comics this month.

[Doc Holliday]

Memo to self: Either buy the latest X-title the second it hits the shelf or stay the hell away from Whedons Av's/custom ranks in the meantime....

(damn you whedon)

Was I not subtle enough? I try to be subtle...

You see...I'm trying to ween myself off emoticons...but I just daren't I think....it was plenty subtle enough....I just figured it out is all....to be honest...the last panel was still Fuck-Yeh-Tastic it was that well-drawn....been a long time since I saw ole Red-eye looks so kick ass whilst not working for a bad guy. I really got the feeling that he was back big time...enough fucking about with guilt, enough introspection, enough phoenix sex games (hmmm...not sure you can have enough of those...but you know what I mean...). Time everyone remembers why he's the one who leads this team...

You speaking of callbacks...how about that one a few issues back of when Storm defeated him for leadership of the team...back in her powerless, mohawk days.

That was a faithful recreation of a panel from the FIRST EVER X-man comic I ever went out and bought....*wipes nostalgic tear*

[r8hitman]

I havent read comics in years, but I keep seeing Thunderbird around.

Now I remember that his younger brother took that name for a while, but I just wanted to know if they ever decided to go back and tell any stories about the "training days" of the New X-Men (Thunderbird, Wolverine, Storm, Nightcrawler, Banshee etc)?

[Keepcoolbutcare]

but I just wanted to know if they ever decided to go back and tell any stories about the "training days" of the New X-Men (Thunderbird, Wolverine, Storm, Nightcrawler, Banshee etc)?

not in Whedon's run on Astonishing, at any rate...

[Ribbons]

but I just wanted to know if they ever decided to go back and tell any stories about the "training days" of the New X-Men (Thunderbird, Wolverine, Storm, Nightcrawler, Banshee etc)?

not in Whedon's run on Astonishing, at any rate...

Burl...?

[Doc Holliday]

I havent read comics in years, but I keep seeing Thunderbird around.

Now I remember that his younger brother took that name for a while, but I just wanted to know if they ever decided to go back and tell any stories about the "training days" of the New X-Men (Thunderbird, Wolverine, Storm, Nightcrawler, Banshee etc)?

As I remember it Thunnderbird was dead like that *clicks fingers* so wouldn't figure even in a retrospective.

I don't know about the rest of the New X-Men...but today I see they are releasing something approaching "The Forgotten Files" of the original 5, set way back when they first started out - anyone got the lowdown on whether this is just a cash-raker or a worthy title?

[DennisMM]

The closest thing they've had to info on the early days of the "All-New" team of the '70s were extra pages/stories in the back of X-Men Classics/Classic X-Men in the '80s, so far as I"m aware. They retconned some early material in the recent Deadly Genesis. As for First Class, I have my doubts. They're not even drawing the costumes correctly. They've been redesigned so the "X" at the waist is a design, not a belt buckle. <sigh>

[Doc Holliday]

As for First Class, I have my doubts. They're not even drawing the costumes correctly. They've been redesigned so the "X" at the waist is a design, not a belt buckle. <sigh>

FIRST CLASS! Thank you Dennis...that was what it was called. I have only seen the one advert for it and I was torn on the costumes...they're trying to do both aren't they...to have their cake and eat it...trying to modernise the look but stay faithful to the classic design.

Seems kind of fucked up to me - I mean, if you're going to acknowledge the classics like that [i.e. with the launch of a whole title] you really shouldn't be messing with something as fundamental as the costume...I mean, you got to figure that the target audience are the oldies like me who want to reminisce...otherwise, what is the point? Who are the stories for? You got your Ultimates line for the younger new audience and fuck knows how many other stories out there for the contemporary adult audience.

I mean, on the one hand no biggy...but on the other not a very inspiring start. They need to get Iceman and Angel right in particular...I think out of all X-Men those two have been badly served too many times in the past - back in their hey-day they had some real snappy interchanges - they were always the two cool-looking heroes to the stick in the mud that was cyclops (sorry whedo).....

[DennisMM]

If anyone doubts the effectiveness of the original costume design , or at least only a minor tweaking of it, look at John Cassaday's version of Kitty (ugh) Pryde. That is X-Men classic drawn in a real-world manner. The fabric fits closely. The belts are kinda clunky, but they're functional. They keep your pants up!

[Doc Holliday]

They keep your pants up!

Not when its on Kitty Pryde it don't.

Oh man...colour me wrong.

So it has come to this. A new low.

Inevitably, I guess.

[DennisMM]

If Whedon could have Kitty phase through the floor when she came you can make a joke about her keeping her panties on. Can she phase just her clothes so you can fuck her through her clothes? That would be truly weird.

[MasterWhedon]

If Whedon could have Kitty phase through the floor when she came you can make a joke about her keeping her panties on. Can she phase just her clothes so you can fuck her through her clothes? That would be truly weird.

This thread just took a turn...

[Keepcoolbutcare]

Can she phase just her clothes so you can fuck her through her clothes? That would be truly weird.

she can phase her clothes.

she can phase your clothes.

she can sit on your lap, and ya'll can fuck in public.

Kitty rulez.

[Bob Samonkey]

Can she phase just her clothes so you can fuck her through her clothes? That would be truly weird.

she can phase her clothes.

she can phase your clothes.

she can sit on your lap, and ya'll can fuck in public.

Kitty rulez.

Wow. I need to start picking up these comics!!!

[AtomicHyperbole]

If Whedon could have Kitty phase through the floor when she came you can make a joke about her keeping her panties on. Can she phase just her clothes so you can fuck her through her clothes? That would be truly weird.

I'm a little bit drunk right now and have so many images spinning around in my mind. You've added to the confusion. CONGRATS!

[Lady Sheridan]

You guuuuuuuuyyyyssss!!!

Whatever. Wolverine has a healing factor so he can go all night long.