BATTLESTAR GALACTICA (Now w/ Happy Trails...)

[LegoKenobi]

your theory makes sense to me, baxter. i'm in.

i also forgot to mention that in last week's podcast, ron moore also mentioned that, in retrospect, they dwelled too much on adama's breakdowns. he said he was really into the concept of breaking adama down to nothing after doing so much to portray him as the hard-nosed backbone of the fleet, and when they were filming all the episodes it didn't seem like they had him cracking too much, but after seeing all the episodes back-to-back he felt that they did show it too much. so, everyone who felt it was too much can take some happiness out of that.

[Fievel]

even worse, after tonight... NO MORE CRAZY BSG THEORIES!!!!!!!!!

so this is my last chance to throw out a crazy BSG theory. after tonight, every question will either have an answer, or will never be answered.
so here is my ALL-TIME FINAL crazy BSG theory. this is based in part on that EJO speech at the UN, and a modification of Pacino's "humans ARE cylons" theory.
the point of EJO's speech is that there is only one race: the human race. the notion of race is used to divide us and rationalize war and destroying other people's cultures. so, applying that theme to the BSG universe, you would have to assume that humans and cylons are the same race, and that cavill is the one trying to use the notion of race (human race vs. cylon race) to divide them and justify war. but if humans and cylons ARE the same race then what are they? i think they are HYBRIDS. specifically, the 13 tribes of kobol were one tribe of pure cylons (who went to earth) and 12 tribes of mixed-race hybrids. there are no pure humans left, but the 12 tribes were so intermixed that some are more or less 'cylon' than others, but everyone is at least part cylon. the ones who have more cylon blood end up like roslin, having opera-house visions, or like starbuck's daddy, who, like hera, the only KNOWN hybrid, knew that earth song even though he'd never been there. the more cylon blood you've got, the more you can tap into those visions, songs, and all the other underlying cylonish stuff going on. as for starbuck... her daddy was a hybrid with a high percentage of cylon blood, and maybe her mommy was carrying some recessive cylon genes or something, so she turned out almost like a pure cylon, kinda like an albino or something, naturally born to two hybrids, and thus was able to spontaneously resurrect when she died. and in the finale, they'll discover they are all really one race of human-cylon hybrids, defeat cavill, and live happily ever after. well, except for adama, roslin, starbuck, and half the fleet, who will all die.

Probably the most ignroant question to ask just a few hours away from the end of the show, but here goes:

Didn't Baltar discover a way of detecting Cylons thru blood tests way back in season 1? If the answer is yes, wouldn't that blow your whole theory?


And seriously, sorry for the welcome member of the Zone question, but I've lost interest/regained interest/lost interest so many times with this show that I've missed some critical info

And couldn't Baltar have been lying?

[TheBaxter]

or the cylon test only worked on pure-blood cylons, or on the new skinjobs, but not on hybrids or the original cylons from the 13th tribe.

[so sorry]

or the cylon test only worked on pure-blood cylons, or on the new skinjobs, but not on hybrids or the original cylons from the 13th tribe.

So I was RIGHT!?!?!

[Fievel]

or the cylon test only worked on pure-blood cylons, or on the new skinjobs, but not on hybrids or the original cylons from the 13th tribe.

Frakkin' muggles!!!

[TheBaxter]

or the cylon test only worked on pure-blood cylons, or on the new skinjobs, but not on hybrids or the original cylons from the 13th tribe.

So I was RIGHT!?!?!

huh? if baltar's test only worked on pure-blood skinjobs, not hybrids, and if all the human characters are actually hybrids, then his test wouldn't have worked on them. think about it: baltar's test was designed to tell the difference between a skinjob, of which only a few were known at the time, and a "human"... but all the humans are actually hybrids of humans and the original 13th tribe cylons... so baltar's test actually only tells the difference between the 100% pure new skinjob cylons and 13th-tribe-based hybrids who thought they were human. there are no pure-blood humans left, so there'd be no way to make a test that could tell the difference between them and hybrids or cylons.

[so sorry]

or the cylon test only worked on pure-blood cylons, or on the new skinjobs, but not on hybrids or the original cylons from the 13th tribe.

So I was RIGHT!?!?!

huh? if baltar's test only worked on pure-blood skinjobs, not hybrids, and if all the human characters are actually hybrids, then his test wouldn't have worked on them. think about it: baltar's test was designed to tell the difference between a skinjob, of which only a few were known at the time, and a "human"... but all the humans are actually hybrids of humans and the original 13th tribe cylons... so baltar's test actually only tells the difference between the 100% pure new skinjob cylons and 13th-tribe-based hybrids who thought they were human. there are no pure-blood humans left, so there'd be no way to make a test that could tell the difference between them and hybrids or cylons.

So I WASN'T right?!?!?!

[TheBaxter]

or the cylon test only worked on pure-blood cylons, or on the new skinjobs, but not on hybrids or the original cylons from the 13th tribe.

So I was RIGHT!?!?!

huh? if baltar's test only worked on pure-blood skinjobs, not hybrids, and if all the human characters are actually hybrids, then his test wouldn't have worked on them. think about it: baltar's test was designed to tell the difference between a skinjob, of which only a few were known at the time, and a "human"... but all the humans are actually hybrids of humans and the original 13th tribe cylons... so baltar's test actually only tells the difference between the 100% pure new skinjob cylons and 13th-tribe-based hybrids who thought they were human. there are no pure-blood humans left, so there'd be no way to make a test that could tell the difference between them and hybrids or cylons.

So I WASN'T right?!?!?!

we'll know in 3 hours.

[LegoKenobi]

all this last-minute theorizing is making my head hurt!
lol

so, baltar's device... if it did work... really only checked for pure-bloods! everyone else is too mud-blooded to register, no?

it's so crazy, it might WORK.

[papalazeru]

all this last-minute theorizing is making my head hurt!
lol

so, baltar's device... if it did work... really only checked for pure-bloods! everyone else is too mud-blooded to register, no?

it's so crazy, it might WORK.

It's only the crazies who come up with multiple theories that are going to win because the ultimate chance is that ONE has got to be right.

I gave up guessing a long time ago because everyone was wrong.

[Tyrone_Shoelaces]

I seem to remember Baltar breaking down and tearfully admitting the Cylon detector doesn't work.




Sshhhh, it's starting.

[Tyrone_Shoelaces]

Just to sum up the first 40 minutes: oh. my. god.

[LegoKenobi]

i am hereby not reading any more updates to this forum until after 10:15pm PST.

[ONeillSG1]

LOL! THE TALKBACKERS WERE RIGHT!!!!

[Tyrone_Shoelaces]

All I'm going to say right now is that I liked how it ended.

[ONeillSG1]

All I'm going to say right now is that I liked how it ended.

As did I.

[TheBaxter]

so, the ultimate message of battlestar galactica is: those silly japanese robots will be the doom of us all.

[Bloo]

I've kinda stayed off the board and the Talkbacks for BSG these last couple of weeks

I enjoyed it...Ultimatly I think the journay was more enjoyable then the destitation but I loved the ride there

[DennisMM]

They forgot the bit about how 95 percent of the Colonials died in the first ten years of the colonization, but those 75 left alive managed to intermingle/interbreed successfully with the native humans - however it happened. Either that, or they all died and only Hera went on to interbreed with the natives.

Angels? Really? Angels? Bloody angels?

[Chairman Kaga]

I really enjoyed the finale.
I didn't have the pleasure of watching this show since it started I only got caught up before 4.5 via Netflix. Overall this is probably my favorite sci-fi/fantasy series. I never liked the original which unfortunately made me stay clear of this version.

None of the things that seem to bother the TBers bothered me especially Starbuck.

[TheBaxter]

i kinda have to take some time to wrap my head around the finale, and probably watch it again, but a few things...

i loved the use of original BSG theme as galactica heads into the sun
i wished they'd set up the ending with a bit more inhead-baltar. we've had plenty of inhead-six over the seasons, but inhead-baltar barely had a few scenes. yet they seemed like equals by the end.
ron moore just HAD to get in a cameo, didn't he?
i liked starbuck's disappearing act.
the overall ending was a bit of a deus ex machina... well, actually, the entire finale was one big deus ex machina. i guess all the questions got answered, since you can consider "it was god's plan" to be the answer to pretty much anything and everything.
all the "earth isn't the real earth" people were right. except... OUR earth isn't the real earth.
and my "humans are all hybrids" theory was almost right... 'cos hera is our eve and therefore WE'RE all hybrids.
ultimately, right now i feel like the PLOT ending was a bit unsatisfactory. lots of holes, but you can fill in any hole with "god's plan" explanations, just like creationists explain away evolutionary evidence that pokes holes in their beliefs as "god put it there to test our faith", etc. "god" can always be used to explain away any plot holes.
but at least on a character level, it was satisfying.

[TheBaxter]

They forgot the bit about how 95 percent of the Colonials died in the first ten years of the colonization, but those 75 left alive managed to intermingle/interbreed successfully with the native humans - however it happened. Either that, or they all died and only Hera went on to interbreed with the natives.

the other colonials didn't die off, necessarily... but ultimately, whatever races they spawned wherever they colonized died off at some point, so that all of us left today had hera as our common ancestor. at least that's how i took it.

[fangeek]

Brilliant, bloody frakking brilliant. I loved it. Every last moment. I was watching the finale with a fellow BSG fan and we went insane for the action, the special effects. Side note the next time I read about some complaining about how the movie or show would have been better if they had a bigger budget for special effects I am going to bring up this show as the marker for these people to try and reach. The effects were just out of this world. I had to have my friend check the time at the end of the first hour because i was sure that we had reached the end there was just so much jammed into 60 minutes. I had no problems that they ended starbuck the way they did. In fact I enjoyed it and it made sense. Loved, Loved, Loved the Chief-Tory scene. What sweet justice that was. One word, Romo. Enough said. Cavil and a gun. Another gem of a moment. I loved how Boomer was able to redeem herself. But I also thought it was fitting that Athena was the one to bring her to her end. There were so many amazing scenes that it is hard to pick my favorite. Although the moment when the Galatica rammed the colony was pretty sweet.

Thank you Ron Moore for allowing us the pleasure of sharing this wonderful journey.

[Fievel]

From Cottle's scene to the Epilogue..... awesome.

[RogueScribner]

I'm not reading a single post, I just wanted to say that I missed it tonight and it'll be at least until tomorrow until I can see it!!!


GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!

[Fievel]

I'm not reading a single post, I just wanted to say that I missed it tonight and it'll be at least until tomorrow until I can see it!!!


GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!

Adama is Daniel.


As I was typing that, I just remembered the name of Eric Stoltz's character in Caprica - Daniel Graystone.
Coincidence? God's plan? Reaching farther than a reacharound with a really studly man?

[LegoKenobi]

OM-frackin-GOD!

count me in as loving it. sure, there were big leaps of faith (EVERYONE was ok with just abandoning technology? really??), but overall, the major character arcs and overarching story arcs were great to me. i was really bummed when i thought that helo died, but was also equally surprised (and happy) to see him at the end. LOVE that starbuck was an angel appearing to all the humans from the moment she returned from earth. roslin's death really brought tears to my eyes. and tying the whole gaius thread together (he CAME from farming roots, didn't he? romo called him on his fake accent *ages ago* -- and the scene last episode with his dad underlined it) was just great.

laughed at ron moore's cameo. can't blame him. loved the scene with roslin making doc cottle break into tears. LOVED the scene with the chief and tori.

many more things i'm sure... need time to process....

overall, bravo. i'll miss this show.

PS -- what the frack was the commercial with the voiceover done by adama, saying "see it all from their (cylon) side" -- coming this fall??

[Chairman Kaga]

OM-frackin-GOD!

count me in as loving it. sure, there were big leaps of faith (EVERYONE was ok with just abandoning technology? really??),

PS -- what the frack was the commercial with the voiceover done by adama, saying "see it all from their (cylon) side" -- coming this fall??

I don't think that's much of a leap of faith. The pinnacle of their technology nuked their race into almost extinction and chased them across a million lightyears of space trying to exterminate them for the past 4 years. I think most people under those circumstances may have a general disdain for tech.

That is the tv movie "The Plan" retelling major parts from the entire series but from the perspective of the Cylons. It's supposed to be airing sometime this fall.

[LegoKenobi]

OM-frackin-GOD!

count me in as loving it. sure, there were big leaps of faith (EVERYONE was ok with just abandoning technology? really??),

PS -- what the frack was the commercial with the voiceover done by adama, saying "see it all from their (cylon) side" -- coming this fall??

I don't think that's much of a leap of faith. The pinnacle of their technology nuked their race into almost extinction and chased them across a million lightyears of space trying to exterminate them for the past 4 years. I think most people under those circumstances may have a general disdain for tech.

That is the tv movie "The Plan" retelling major parts from the entire series but from the perspective of the Cylons. It's supposed to be airing sometime this fall.

regarding the technology disdain... when you put it that way, yeah, i get it. see? i'm still processing. i can see people wanting to live a simpler life after the hell they've been through.

and somehow i missed that "plan" show before this. it looks... interesting.

[bill blake]

when starbuck disappeared i cried.

it was short lived though, having to endure roselyn's creepy post coitus then eventual death.

i'm going to be grooving on this story for a while.

ramming the galactica into the colony!!!!!!

this show will be missed.

[Lord Voldemoo]

SPOILERS, IF YOU HAVEN'T SEEN THE FINALE STOP READING NOW

What a frakking show! I don't just mean the finale, the show as a whole.

Whomever said above that the journey is more satisfying than the destination is absolutely right, in nearly all cases. Here, the destination was more satisfying than most.

I too had some trouble with the idea that everyone was so ready to drop the tech and scatter...but as I continued to think about it it makes a great deal of sense. First of all, you have the obvious case for technophobia as noted above. As for the scattering, well when the original series described the fleet as "rag-tag" they weren't kidding. This was a group of people thrown into impossibly tight quarters for years, people who were held together ONLY by threat of extinction at the end of the day, and even then often not very well. The idea that many of the groups would leap at the chance to go their separate ways and explore makes a great deal of sense. The only problem I had was Adama. It makes sense, I just don't like it from a sentimental standpoint i suppose. I'd have liked to see him reunited with Lee and Tigh at the end. Again, that's purely a sentimental thing, I think.

The god/higher power/angels idea is not a cop-out. It has been a constant throughout the series. That said, it is.........I guess a shortcut to many, many answers. As noted above, anything that doesn't quite make sense (from the visions of Six and Baltar to the Opera House to Starbuck's resurrection to Baltar being alive 150k years later) can be explained away as "God's Plan". It is convenient, but it is a convenience that is consistent with the whole of the series.

My sentimentality around Adama aside, plot conveniences aside, I was incredibly satisfied with the end of each and every character arc. When is the last time one could say that about the end of a series of this depth? An absolutely amazing job.

Much, much more to say as I think more about the finale. I'm looking forward to "The Plan". Im not sure how much I'm looking forward to Caprica. It looks a bit like a Soap Opera! Only time will tell on that one.

[Mighty Chin]

I guess when the producers created the tag line “All of this has happened before and it will happen again” they must have just thought it was a throw away line. Apparently that is the line that tied the series together because all of the foreshadowing they have thrown at us led most fans of the show think that the Battlestar Galactica along with Adama and Roslin and much of the cast was going to go out in a blaze of glory. Boy did that not happen at all! I for one am very thankful.

Too many times in the past have I been left wondering what happened next in the Sci-Fi shows of the last 20 or so years? Star Trek the Next Generation satisfied most followers with its finale, we knew what and where the characters did because of Feature Films. Star Trek DS9 left so many with unresolved issues that really didn’t matter overall, just my opinion. There were others but not really relevant to what I am trying to covey. The show that really seemed to upset people was Star Trek Voyager and its finale. This is the one that seems most relevant because of the similarities between the two series. Now I don’t want to denigrate BSG by comparing it to Voyager, a much inferior show by leaps and bounds. The only similarity I will acknowledge is the Journey. The journey is what BSG was all about but what the journey was and how it was achieved was where the two shows were *insert sci-fi term for distance here (parsec, light-year, micron) apart.

Voyager’s journey was one of objective. The crew wants to get home but will only do so within the moral boundaries of the Prime Directive. How many times could they have taken the easy way out? Instead Janeway chose the higher moral ground. This led to very many scenarios where the crew had “Hope” of returning home but lost it by episodes end. That word “Hope” is the difference I think between the two shows.

BSG’s initial Mini-series left Humanity with the “Hope” of a better tomorrow with the promise of finding earth, an age old legend of a 13th colony of the Human race. This was their last best chance for life and love in the shadow of the greatest holocaust ever known. From that mini-series forward into the actual series this version of Battlestar Galactica conveyed what the original series never did! Actual loss! You felt it in every scene that first year, everything every character had ever known was gone and all they had left was a thin thread of “Hope”. Not to ever see their loved ones again but instead a chance to live another day. Desperation would set in over the season’s and be conveyed differently by all the major and minor characters. Adama the stoic but non believer in the promised land that he himself had promised. Roslin was the reluctant leader who goes along with Adama as a sign of unity. Right down to minor characters the likes of Captain Kelly who showed his obvious strain at the events that led him to where he made his decisions. Then there was Kat who used stims to deal with the pressure of it all and even Cally who apparently unbeknownst to the Chief was having her way with every deckhand just so she could feel something. This is what BSG boiled down to that Voyager could and would never achieve or the Original Battlestar Galactica really missed the boat on. It’s all about the characters journey not the overall journey. Where Voyager should have made better choices with theirs, the Original BSG never realized that it had a choice, it was a victim of it’s time and lack of imagination of the perils in life.

Battlestar Galactica the 2003-09 version, my Battlestar Galactica got it right; boy did they get it right. In the end it was what it should have been a journey of the soul. Not a destination for a better future, safe and secure from Cylon tyranny but instead a chance to start anew with legitimate “Hope”. This show was about characters coming to grips with their past, present and future! This is what this show is about and I think some “Fans” forgot that along the way. This was never more present than the last few episodes where a lot of fans decried “nothing happened”. I guess they wanted more space battles going on as characters found answers to questions left hanging. They called those episodes “filler” or “introspective” shows that failed to advance the story line. Where they are wrong is that those episodes are advancing the storyline, not the story line they have created in their heads wishing to see played out on screen but the story line of the characters on the journey.

I like that the Producers threw a few threads at us that led “Fans” to believe that the show was going to go a certain way and instead pretty much left everybody alive and unscathed. I have seen many behind the scenes vignettes where the Producers stated that they didn’t want to do what had been done before. Well I think they accomplished it! I loved this Finale; it touched my heart in so many ways. Almost every character tugged at my heart strings and brought tears to my eyes.

Standouts for the Finale are the following

* Mary McDonnell - By far the best acting I have ever seen. Bravo.
* Edward James Olmos - Any man who can puke and still make me smile has it all
* James Callis - His final scene stating he knows how to Farm was gut wrenching.
* Aaron Douglas – The rage in his eyes! Wow!
* Jamie Bamber – I think he knew all along
* Donnelly Rhodes – His scene with Roslin was so emotional and his reaction to her words was priceless.
* I loved the whole Opera house tie in. Perfect!
* The Galactica’s final jump and the moans from a broken ship.

I also loved the incorporation of the original BSG theme as well as Baltar’s little comment about how he could have his head cut off.

What I wished I could have seen more of.

* Callum Keith Rennie – I felt Leoben needed one or two finale scenes with Kara.
* More Cylons – I just didn’t really feel that the Crew was in any real danger. I thought the special effects on the Metal Cylons needed work. But boy did the Galactica take a pounding when the jumped in to the Colony.

I know I didn’t really go into the finale episode so much, instead I gave an over all opinion on the series as whole. I tend to look at shows like this as a whole and try not to judge them until the series in complete. Sure there have been bad episodes which at the time left you wondering “what were the writers thinking?” even in those episodes the acting always pulled it up out of the mud and what acting it was!

Wow! How good is Michael Hogan? Right from the start he was my favorite character and throughout the series he kept getting better and better. Nobody said Frak better than Saul Tigh (it’s in the Frakking ship). Boy I sure wish his scene with Starbuck on New Caprica made the final cut, what a great scene between two characters that did not like one another.

Aaron Douglas who played Chief Tyrol was amazing and when I had the pleasure of attending the BSG series wrap party I had the hardest time approaching. Even then I couldn’t muster the courage to ask for a picture.

Grace Park my Asian persuasion. What a pivotal character she played throughout her incarnations. The Model with the most human of frailties proved that choice is all that matters in life.

Tricia Helfer is probably the greatest standout of them all as she had literally no acting experience at all. What the writers gave her and how she made every single copy of her model different is a true testament to her amazing talent. And boy is she good looking!

James Callis brought so much to the role of Baltar that it’s almost impossible for me to think of John Colicos’s version of him. Oh well he will always be Kor to me. That light hearted moment between Adama and Baltar was great.

Katee Sackhoff and Jamie Bamber were the two characters that had the hardest time I think fitting into the roles that were so Iconically portrayed before them. I think they did an amazing job making them as different and alike as they possibly could.

To even give words to how great Eddie and Mary were would do a disservice to them. Simply they were perfect! End of Line!

[TheBaxter]

OM-frackin-GOD!

count me in as loving it. sure, there were big leaps of faith (EVERYONE was ok with just abandoning technology? really??),

PS -- what the frack was the commercial with the voiceover done by adama, saying "see it all from their (cylon) side" -- coming this fall??

I don't think that's much of a leap of faith. The pinnacle of their technology nuked their race into almost extinction and chased them across a million lightyears of space trying to exterminate them for the past 4 years. I think most people under those circumstances may have a general disdain for tech.

i didn't have too much problem with the "throwing tech away" bit either. after spending 4+ or however many years cooped up on spaceships, i think just about anyone would be ready to go live on a commune on a nice sunny planet with lots of plants and animals. besides, i didn't take it as them necessarily throwing EVERYTHING away, just the spaceships and guns and stuff (and the raptors, obviously they kept those... wonder what ever became of them?). i don't think they threw out whatever was left of their meager supplies, the toothpaste and alcohol and deodorant and underwear and whatever else that i've been wondering all these years how they didn't run out of already. it's probably not like anyone in the fleet really knew how to make more toothpaste, although baltar probably could've figured it out if he'd wanted to.

[papalazeru]

I cried when Roslin struggled for breath in the field. Roslins death moved me to the core. I cried when Galactica flew into the sun with the original score humming in the background, Anders leading his final perfect throw for the goal line. It might have done better with the tune of Bonanza though.

A monumental ending for a monumental show. It didn't over reach into 17 billion series, it was just plain fucking beautiful.

Angels? Really? Angels? Bloody angels?

Yeah, I was a bit like that.

It really didn't need the future ending though, especially when Faerie 6 and Gaius turned up...bleh!


10 out of frakin' 10.

Perfect for me. It feels complete, I need no more. And if it's, 'all this has happened before...' load of bollocks, why do we need to see a prequel?

[Fievel]

Mighty Chin - Fantastic first post! Wish you were here earlier!

What I liked, no LOVED, about the finale (in no particular order):

-Doc Cottle's scene. Roslin's line about saving his image summed it up for all of us.

-The Redemption of Gaius Baltar. He redeemed himself to the fleet (Apollo) somewhat by staying and fighting. He redeemed himself to his dead father by accepting his past. He redeemed himself to Caprica by making her proud and loving her. And then he redeemed his soul by actually showing selfless emotion when he broke down crying on Earth. Fantastic arc.

-Tyrol's Rage. Even though Callie was a lowly human that cheated on him.... he loved her.

-Cavill's death. Fitting.

-Roslin's death. Beautiful. The ring was a great touch.

-Special Effects. Awesome. The best they've ever been. I'd loved to have seen this in a theater.

-The relevance of All Along the Watchtower and the Opera House.

-Saul & Ellen Tigh - I hated Ellen when she was first introduced and cheered her death. She was instantly annoying in her return as well. But between the flashbacks to the bar and the way she was at the end, I absolutely loved them being back together.

-Anders' End. His goodbye to Starbuck surprised me, although I wish he would have shed a single tear.

-Colonials and Centurions fighting side-by-side. HOLY FRAK!!! That was awesome!!! Lee giving signs to the Centurions was so cool to see!!!

-President Romo! Awesome. Even better seeing him on Earth STILL wearing the trenchcoat and sunglasses.

-Admiral Hoshi. You know, the guy takes a HUGE risk in starting a homosexual relationship within the fleet. Then his boyfriend ends up being a mutinous assface. It was cool to see Hoshi get some props.

-Helo Lives! I thought he was dead.

-Classic BSG Theme! Nice.

-The Epilogue. I wish there was actually about a minute more of dialogue between the In-Heads, but I loved it all the same. I loved how they were showing that we could very well be headed in the same direction with the robotics that are currently here. Normally epilogues like that make me roll my eyes, but that was perfect.

Things I either didn't like or was ambiguous about:

-Ron Moore. Should have been Cro-Magnon instead of a modern day guy.

-Bill Adama. I thought he was going to kill himself when Roslin died. I actually wouldn't have had a problem with that. But to just willingly exile himself away from the only family he has? Didn't like that.

-Kara's Disappearance. Didn't hate it, didn't love it. It fit, for sure. I guess it just reflected off of her & Lee's flashback that their relationship was doomed from the onset.

-Lack of Leoben. As said above, I would liked to have had closure between he and Kara.

-Hot Dog. Did he survive the battle? Is his and Callie's kid still alive?

-Daniel. Why even mention him of he doesn't play a part? I'm seriously wondering if there's any connection with him to Caprica's Daniel Graystone.

-The ending on Earth. I wish they would have shown some of the initial exploration where they saw the different continents. That would have been cool. At times this episode felt rushed.

This was a great finale. It didn't unseat Six Feet Under as my favorite finale, but it's definitely up there.

[Chairman Kaga]

Baltar being alive 150k years later) can be explained away as "God's Plan".

I believe because they look exactly the same as earlier in the episode that isn't Baltar and Caprica Six but their "angel"/inner/head versions (note Baltar's suit, slicked back hair and Caprica's standard slinky red dress etc). Thus Baltar and Caprica are long dead. Their conversation seems to cement that idea (talking about all the previous cycles they have witnessed as "angels".
Not saying you're wrong but that's how I took it rather than the physical Caprica and Baltar living 150,000 years together.

[Lord Voldemoo]

Baltar being alive 150k years later) can be explained away as "God's Plan".

I believe because they look exactly the same as earlier in the episode that isn't Baltar and Caprica Six but their "angel"/inner/head versions (note Baltar's suit, slicked back hair and Caprica's standard slinky red dress etc). Thus Baltar and Caprica are long dead. Their conversation seems to cement that idea (talking about all the previous cycles they have witnessed as "angels".
Not saying you're wrong but that's how I took it rather than the physical Caprica and Baltar living 150,000 years together.

Yeah, I actually re-watched it this morning and I think you're exactly right. And I think it's very clear that they are the angels, not the Physical Six and Baltar, and probably everyone but me took that as a given on the first showing . I owe my initial confusion to lack of sleep, emotional exhaustion after watching the finale, and several scotch and sodas.

[Chairman Kaga]

Baltar being alive 150k years later) can be explained away as "God's Plan".

I believe because they look exactly the same as earlier in the episode that isn't Baltar and Caprica Six but their "angel"/inner/head versions (note Baltar's suit, slicked back hair and Caprica's standard slinky red dress etc). Thus Baltar and Caprica are long dead. Their conversation seems to cement that idea (talking about all the previous cycles they have witnessed as "angels".
Not saying you're wrong but that's how I took it rather than the physical Caprica and Baltar living 150,000 years together.

Yeah, I actually re-watched it this morning and I think you're exactly right. And I think it's very clear that they are the angels, not the Physical Six and Baltar, and probably everyone but me took that as a given on the first showing . I owe my initial confusion to lack of sleep, emotional exhaustion after watching the finale, and several scotch and sodas.

On that note I do have to say I am very happy that Baltar grew so much over the series, gained some redemption in the end and reunited with Caprica (I really didn't like the whole Tigh/Caprica relationship). Baltar has always been my favorite character and though perhaps a bit cliche that the conniving, cowardly "villian" can turn around, I still found it to be an excellent story.

[Hermanator X]

Hot Dog. Did he survive the battle? Is his and Callie's kid still alive?

Its fair to say the kid didnt cross the red line and stayed with the main fleet, and hotdog reported the raiders breaking off from combat then headed home to galactica (and he is EJO's son in real life. lucky bugger didnt inherit his dads skin. )

Loved it. Cant post much at the mo, but I thought it was a great wrap up. And they didnt go the whole hog with the religious aspect, or they would have only landed 4000 years ago.....

[papalazeru]

So, if all this has 'happened before and will happen again', why do we need a prequel?

[Tyrone_Shoelaces]

The more I think about the finale and let it soak in the more I like it. I really do think each of the character's stories ended on the right note. As much as I would love to see a litter of Starpollo babies walking the Earth it was plainly never meant to be. As hard as it was to watch Adama leave his son and "daughter" he would have been an (even more) ornery cuss if he hadn't. I don't think it too far off to imagine him dying of a broken heart not long after. I would love to see them all smiles at finally finding a home and dancing around the fire every night in happy communion but I don't think that would feel real or genuine. What these people have survived in the last four years is incredible - that Moore and company were able to make us care is astonishing. When Chief says he has had enough of people I believe him. I almost feel like going with him to that small island off one of the northern continents. I've been trying to think of another way for it all to end and I honestly can't think of one. I am thoroughly satisfied. I don't think they put a pretty bow on it like someone was worried about a few posts back but I do think the story ended where it was supposed to, the key word being end. If there is more to the story, as the epilogue points out, it is up to the Children of Hera.

One thing about the epilogue that made me chuckle was Moore's cameo. I noticed him right away but realized later it could be taken another way, purely unintentional I'm sure. Are Head Six and Head Baltar merely reading over his shoulder or are they there with him, whispering an epic story into his ear? Granted it only works if you know who the dude at the newsstand is but I thought it was a great accidental layer of meta.


So today I'm reading the giant Chicago Tribune wrap-up coverage when I turn on Songbird for some music. I have it set to random so I was a little surprised when the first handful of songs to come up kinda fit the mood/tone of the article and in a little way the finale itself. Just to share:

"Just Like Honey" Jesus and Mary Chain
"Jesus Remembered Me" Hank Williams
"Crystal Ball" Keane
"Le deuxieme homme" Serge Gainsbourg
"Time To Go" Supergrass
"Don't Understand" Low


Of special interest in the Tribune article:

Three episodes from Season 4.5 will have longer cuts on DVD (and Moore doesn't know when the DVD will be coming out, by the way):

* The DVD version of "A Disquiet Follows My Soul" will be about 10 minutes longer.
* The DVD version of "Islanded in a Stream of Stars" will be about 15-20 minutes longer.
* The DVD version of "Daybreak," the series finale, will be about 15-20 minutes longer.

I can't wait to watch it all again this summer when the Blu-ray comes out. I would love to take the journey with you again so you're all invited over for some frakkin' punch and pie.

[Fievel]

Of special interest in the Tribune article:

Three episodes from Season 4.5 will have longer cuts on DVD (and Moore doesn't know when the DVD will be coming out, by the way):

* The DVD version of "A Disquiet Follows My Soul" will be about 10 minutes longer.
* The DVD version of "Islanded in a Stream of Stars" will be about 15-20 minutes longer.
* The DVD version of "Daybreak," the series finale, will be about 15-20 minutes longer.

AWESOME news!!!!!

[DennisMM]

This might be a controversial statement, but all hail Gaius Baltar. It took him long enough, but he's a frakking mensch. He's to Galactica what Wesley was to Angel - full of himself, terribly human, prone to massive errors in judgment and, in the end, a hero. Thank the gods he lived to reach that point.

[ONeillSG1]

One thing about the epilogue that made me chuckle was Moore's cameo. I noticed him right away but realized later it could be taken another way, purely unintentional I'm sure. Are Head Six and Head Baltar merely reading over his shoulder or are they there with him, whispering an epic story into his ear? Granted it only works if you know who the dude at the newsstand is but I thought it was a great accidental layer of meta.

If that was intentional, I will push the George Lucas bust off its mantle for a Ron Moore statuette.

[papalazeru]

If that was intentional, I will push the George Lucas bust off its mantle for a Ron Moore statuette.

Which Statuette?

The Indy whip and Fedora hat or the Jar Jar Binks commemorative statuette, plaque and place mat?

[MonkeyM666]

Wow... what a great season finale. I will say it now. BSG is the best television show ever made. Never have I been so emotionally vested, or fascinated with fictional characters. I had tears in my eyes when the camera pulled away from Adama and Roslins grave; was fascinated by the slight of had that was gods work; loved the integration of our earth and battlestars fate. Just a great show, and an equally great cast. I also found it very interesting how the show's writers have reflected our current times with the cleaning of the slate and forgoing our modern possessions, looking at a bigger picture in this economic downturn. It felt saturated in opinions that we need to change our ways. The view of one isn't always the best thing for our future.

I loved this show, and thank Sci-fi for letting David Eick, Ronald D. Moore finish their project on their terms.

EDIT: I can't stop thinking about a few points.

*Starbuck just vanishing. I didn't really get it. If she was an angel then how did we find her body? If she was a ghost the how could everyone see her? If she was from the future then if kinda makes sense as once the timelines were corrected then she would vanish but it wouldn't be so poetic. Also Starbucks father being a Cylon.... I think that the leap was a little stretched and unnecessary. Starbuck could have figured out the song with her own loops visions.

*Head Baltar and Six... when they're chatting at the end Six talks about God and Baltar notes he doesn't like being called that'. I found this extremely interesting and would love too find out more about the higher power.

*Adama. Look I still find it so sad that he left everyone behind to be with Roslin, but I agree with what was said above. He should have met up with the friends/family he cares so dearly for (Tai, his son etc...). I know that Roslin was the love of his life and he would never recover but one thing that the season 4.5 pointed out to me was how much he loves Tai and his crew. I find it odd that they all split up and went their separate ways. Apollo leaving to climb a mountain and explore was nice but he wont always want to do that.... life is longer then one ambition.

*Cavil shooting him self....

Weighing very heavy in my mind is the thought that all we were left with the thought that all of these people that we loved, and who loved each other so deeply in the show, are all part of humanity and they're continuing story is that they survived. The semantics of what they did doesn't matter.... humanity strives on. The love that we feel should be directed at our fellow man, regardless of what their story is.... we are all in this together.


*

[MonkeyM666]

Big ratings for a US cable show. 'Battlestar Galactica' Goes Out With A Ratings Bang

[Tyrone_Shoelaces]

It's up on iTunes already but the Struggling Background Artists have the finale broken up into 3 separate parts.

[Chairman Kaga]

Also Starbucks father being a Cylon.... I think that the leap was a little stretched and unnecessary. Starbuck could have figured out the song with her own loops visions.

This is a fan theory that Moore shot down before the finale.

[John-Locke]

BSG is the best television show ever made.

Wrong, not even close.

The Finale had a few good moments in the first half but overall it was completely Meh.

Good riddance I say.